Replicating the P320 Hack ... with a Glock, and a bunch of other guns

[dickasauraswreks]

CZ75B, or the compact. Or the P01. Or the PCR. I've found all of them to have good grip shape and be very reliable.

 

[eaglemike]

View attachment 81585

There are a couple of P01 in the classifieds now at a fair price. They can still be had. Hopefully the roster will go away someday!

 

[Walmart_AR15]

Why the hostility? I only pointed out the screw video show the Youtuber's gun had gone off in the pre-travel. I did not make a statement that ALL P320 will go off in the trigger pre-travel. Showing other striker fired pistol to fire after trigger is pressed to and beyond the trigger wall just shows those pistols functioned exactly as designed. And none fire while the trigger was in pre-travel. The problem of nailing down the potential flaw in the design if the designer did not initially have taken into consideration is tolerance stacking. With tolerance stacking not every batch of manufactured product will be exactly the same.

So during the military and law enforcement testing, who supplied the weapon? Did military or LE just gone to the commercial market and order the guns off the production line? They are provided by Sig. And like any sensible company going after long term gov contract, the product provided would be QA/QC in detail if not assembled with handpicked parts. I know I would.

Assuming all the Youtubers are not modifying their gun before the video, what we saw in the videos did happen. Just like the machinist showed his P320 variant gone off ONLY after almost 2mm movement pass the trigger wall. As an objective observer, we have to accept both are true. What the discuss left is how, what situation, design, explanation that will result in both being true.

All the different testing folks are doing with their one or two P320 are statistically insignificant. But combine all of them will become statistically significant and maybe provide a clue why some P320 suffer from UD.

Example, forget about how far the trigger movement was, what does the pre-travel trigger movement do? Well, it deactivates the striker block at the beginning of the pre-travel. The trigger does not have to reach the wall for the striker block to be deactivated. So now one safety feature is no longer in play. Next, what caused the striker hook fall off the 1st sear. After we figure that out, then why didn't the 2nd sear catch the striker? Looking at this systematically is the only way to figure out why some P320 suffers from UD.

From another member on this site stating his trigger did not reset after it was pressed to the wall but not fired and his gun can go off by rocking the slide. He was supposedly able to repeat the condition. His gun would be a good candidate submit to the FBI lab for x-ray to see if indeed the trigger did not reset and now the striker block is also deactivated. Maybe even show how much engagement the striker hook is on the sear.

There is another video showing how just by manipulating the slide, the trigger will move backwards. Then the video shows the firing pin coming out of the flash hole. This if true, can be used to hypothesize why putting P320 into a holster may cause it to go UD.

 

[bonesurf]

It's too bad really. I don't have a massive collection, but my two favorite pistols to shoot are my P220 and 92FS Brigadier.

p220 SAO legion is a sweet machine

HK P7 is my next acquisition. they are getting pricey.....and obviously hard to get with being out of production, off roster and not C&R

I primarily carry a p365. WITH a manual safety. in fact. all the guns on my ccw have manual safeties come to think of it

 

[han_solo]

1911s not legal to carry in my (Contra Costa) county... no single action pistols allowed.

I have a double action 1911 for ya .. /0/

 

[GAAPlebees]

There’s no way people are still coping for Sig in 2025 right?

 

[M_N04H]

Coping? I don't know if you're referring to me, but my older Sigs are good. But I sure as hell wouldn't touch anything new from Sig at this point.

 

[wajalama]

If that guy in the original post actually tried to make a fair test, he wouldn't have bypassed the trigger safety blade on the Glock in the first place before pushing it to the wall. Not to mention that trigger on that Glock is literally pressed like 99% of the way (which already well past defeating the FPB), unlike the P320 which had like what, less than 1mm of travel before it went off?



What a garbage comparison.

 

[eaglemike]

Here is a video of duplicating the hack on a Glock. This guy used a cnc to get the digital readout. He was able to get the Glock to fail .019" before the trigger would have released the striker.

 

[BunnySloper]

IMHO, all these videos a bit pointless. What does it prove? Are they looking for a problem so it can be fixed or are they looking for a problem that really doesn’t exist as to say “look! Everyone has this problem. So, Sig’s problem is ok.”

Any gun can malfunction when miss handled or improperly operated. But has Glocks been going off on their own; while just sitting in the holster, in recent years?

 

[eaglemike]

If that guy in the original post actually tried to make a fair test, he wouldn't have bypassed the trigger safety blade on the Glock in the first place before pushing it to the wall. Not to mention that trigger on that Glock is literally pressed like 99% of the way (which already well past defeating the FPB), unlike the P320 which had like what, less than 1mm of travel before it went off?

View attachment 81794

What a garbage comparison.

The numbers you put there aren't accurate. He zero'd the machine differently, but the numbers are explained in the video. The Glock released the striker when the slide was manipulated, BEFORE the trigger would release it. The Glock has a LARGER amount of takeup, but most of the tests for the 320 REMOVE the takeup travel. The takeup is used in both guns to starting moving the safety parts. In the Gray Guns video with the cutaway they show how removing the takeup alters the safety function. In the video for the 320 that the guy above did, he moved it 2mm after the takeup, or pretravel, and then another .019", or another 1/2mm, before manipulating the slide and having the striker fall.

 

[mblat1968]

p220 SAO legion is a sweet machine

HK P7 is my next acquisition. they are getting pricey.....and obviously hard to get with being out of production, off roster and not C&R

I primarily carry a p365. WITH a manual safety. in fact. all the guns on my ccw have manual safeties come to think of it

This is not a critique in any shape or form.
But I would think that if one goes for manual safety then just go to 1911 and be done with it

 

[cali_jazz]

IMHO, all these videos a bit pointless. What does it prove? Are they looking for a problem so it can be fixed or are they looking for a problem that really doesn’t exist as to say “look! Everyone has this problem. So, Sig’s problem is ok.”

Any gun can malfunction when miss handled or improperly operated. But has Glocks been going off on their own; while just sitting in the holster, in recent years?

The point of the videos that respond to Wyoming Gun Project's screw video is to demonstrate that all striker-fired guns will exhibit the same behavior when the striker safety is engaged as part of the trigger pull. In other words, the WGP video does not actually demonstrate anything significant nor explain why the P320's appear to be discharging uncommanded. It also demonstrates sadly how the gun community emotionally overreact and pile on to these YouTube vids without objectivity or critical thought.

Here's an excellent demo and explanation of a Glock 19 with a cool factory cutaway showing how the striker is energized and released in the same way as the 320 and all striker-fired guns.

 

[Walmart_AR15]

It is what I have been trying to say in this thread. Any striker fired pistol with the trigger pressed to and just slightly pass the wall can and will discharge by manipulating the slide. The sear and striker are already disengaging; any additional mechanical movement can cause the disengagement sooner. All the video actually shows all the striker fired pistols tested to function as designed.

The issue being discussed until all these videos showed up is how can a striker fired pistol discharge when trigger is still in the pre-travel before the wall is reached.

With all the videos, we can now confidently state that the striker block (safety) is defeated during the pre-travel, and to defeat P320's striker block safety per design, it may just need ~ 1 mm rearward movement of the trigger.

Out of all this, there may now be a way to test your own P320 if it is in the risky UD pool. (Pref done at the range with the pistol pointed down range) Unload your P320, it, press the trigger to the wall, do not fire. Now press down the front of the slide. If the striker will not release, I think you are good to go. But if the striker does release, you may have a problematic pistol. Repeat this a few times till you are comfortable with the outcome.

 

[TheAverageShooter]

These tests are crazy! Why bypass the build in safeties to show you can get it to discharge? Also it seems in most cases with Glocks they have a setup that takes the trigger to the wall, but when they manipulate the slide they also impact the pressure on the trigger i.e. they did not secure the frame and force on the trigger in an isolated fashion. Look carefully at that vice setup video above you can clearly see the frame move while he is pushing on the slide. I guess it is good way to jump on the hype and get YouTube views

Nevertheless I wouldn't buy a striker fired gun without a blade in the trigger for exactly this reason, to avoid the unintentional take up of the trigger. Glocks and other striker fired guns with the trigger blades avoid the issue of a side brush on the trigger starting the process of pulling the trigger and bypassing the internal safeties. This can happen when holstering the weapon with your finger or clothing catching the side of the trigger or having a holster that has a defect or potential object in it.

Even with that said I have seen too many examples of stock P320s discharging with drop tests or hit by a rubber mullet on the back, with no trigger take up. Perhaps those were early P320s?

 

[Walmart_AR15]

Bit long but very detail discussion of P320 striker safety and trigger travel.

In summary, it needs 2.3mm (0.09”) trigger travel to disengage striker safety. Then another 0.11” pull to release the sear. Thus, why others striker safety release with just 1 mm? The striker safety moves just 0.033” to clear the striker. The thickness of the striker safety is also 0.033”.