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Am I missing something, or Is the Roster just Meh for service pistols?

Walther PDP is on roster

I have the “older” PPQ Q5 Match and the Q5 Match Steel Frame, and I really do love the ergonomics and triggers on the Walthers.

That said, I hate what they did with the California versions of the latest PDP. Instead of handling it like Smith & Wesson or Springfield, they made the California safeties a pain to disable or work around. H&K did similar too.

Maybe it’s a non-US company thing - they just don’t quite sympathize with our California struggles. LOL.


I have 3 Glocks on my permit and don’t intend to change anything in the near future. My primary reason is the money invested in holsters, magazines and training. In 30+ years of owning and shooting Glocks I’ve found them to be accurate and reliable. For competition or hunting I’d carry a different gun but for every day carry they work.

Right on!!

That said, Glocks can absolutely hold their own in competition, even against the fancier and more expensive guns. 😏


Get a 2011 at MSRP, or you can get the new staccato HD on roster gun- I got the C4X and love it. It runs glock mags and isn't a series 70 trigger so it will match what you are used to- but if you have more money available- I'd go for a real staccato XC, or another 2011 and buy new as a single shot

I’m actually seriously considering it. I just need to find a place where I can try them properly; not just slow-fire, one-round-every-few-seconds type of shooting.

Apparently, there are some form-factor issues with certain Staccatos, though I can’t remember the exact details. It was mentioned in passing during one tactical/defensive class where a good number of students and instructors were running 2011s.... And I was running a Glock 17... 😅
 
I was shopping for a truck. Came down to an F-150 and a Tundra. Both V8, naturally aspirated, older.

Talked to some people. Hey, they're both trucks, and both V8s. What's their opinion?

Some people couldn't live with anything other than a Ford truck, while others couldn't live with anything other than a Toyota truck. Even though both had the same size beds, similar enough tow capability, etc.

Use whatever you can live with in your mind.
Dont really see the point in owning a fullsize halfton truck with a massive V8 gas guzzling engine. If you arent hauling anything might as well go V6 turbo. If you are hauling get at least a three quarter ton diesel. I have a V6 2.7L turbo F150. That engine is incredible. Has a iron upper engine block. I get ave 20-22 MPGs. Tundras are reliable but they get terrible MPGs like 15-17 MPGs.
 
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I have the “older” PPQ Q5 Match and the Q5 Match Steel Frame, and I really do love the ergonomics and triggers on the Walthers.

That said, I hate what they did with the California versions of the latest PDP. Instead of handling it like Smith & Wesson or Springfield, they made the California safeties a pain to disable or work around. H&K did similar too.

Maybe it’s a non-US company thing - they just don’t quite sympathize with our California struggles. LOL.




Right on!!

That said, Glocks can absolutely hold their own in competition, even against the fancier and more expensive guns. 😏




I’m actually seriously considering it. I just need to find a place where I can try them properly; not just slow-fire, one-round-every-few-seconds type of shooting.

Apparently, there are some form-factor issues with certain Staccatos, though I can’t remember the exact details. It was mentioned in passing during one tactical/defensive class where a good number of students and instructors were running 2011s.... And I was running a Glock 17... 😅
It's a German thing - you will follow ze rules and like it
 
Dont really see the point in owning a fullsize halfton truck with a massive V8 gas guzzling engine. If you arent hauling anything might as well go V6 turbo. If you are hauling get at least a three quarter ton diesel. I have a V6 2.7L turbo F150. That engine is incredible. Has a steel engine block. I get ave 20-22 MPGs. Tundras are reliable but they get terrible MPGs like 15-17 MPGs.

I try to do too much with one truck so I ended up with a 6.2L F-150 Raptor. Tows, hauls, goes off road, it's great.

MPG sucks, agreed, but I enabled the factory flex fuel option. $2.26 a gallon corn juice. 3 MPG less (down to 9 from 12) but the savings balance out at about 50% less cost over the same distance driven due to the cheaper corn juice cost.

Totally agree that your V6TT F-150 works for you. See? What we can live with in our head. Like owning only Glocks. It's been an on-point analogy. :D
 
Agree with you, OP.

They all go ‘bang’ when you pull the trigger.

Some feel a bit better in the hand than others.

Newer models are OR out of the box, but also have LCI and mag disconnects. And if you’re not exempt from the 11% tax, that’s another issue.

The 2011 is very different and very nice to shoot. I’ve got an Atlas Titan RDS and a Platypus. Both are accurate and fun. A great contrast to the polymer 9’s.
Based on my experience and going back to comments (pre-internet) from individuals I knew who were born as far back as 1920, once you get your firearms and ensure they are reliable, often there is little truly new innovation or reason to explore new firearms whether pistol, rifle, or shotgun. In fact, I’d go so far as to say, most of us would be better off to stop looking and spend money on going to the range and training. Don’t get me wrong, I still like looking. Until the hand held small Star Trek phasers hit the market, I’m likely not that interested.
 
Your sentiment is fair and understandable because striker fired weapons are mostly the same. They fit your hands a bit differently and some triggers are nicer but they still feel very similar. This has nothing to do with the roster though unless you think the FN509 and P10 family of guns are somehow gonna make you feel all warm the fuzzy. Blaming the roster is nonsense because we have a sample / representation of every popular striker fired (or duty/service) weapons you can buy in free America.

What you are feeling is the burning desire to spend money on something nicer, maybe a Shadow 2 or maybe a 2011 just something SAO and hammer fired. I shoot strikers because they are easy to own but I enjoy shooting the hammers way more. But if you don't think they are worth the money and you still don't like the striker stuff then it just strikes me as you don't really enjoy pistols that much.
 
TL;DR: I’m not a Glock fanboy, but after investing in the Glock ecosystem - mags, holsters, parts, optics, training, and competition, I don’t see enough performance gain from another Rostered service pistol to justify switching. With California’s magazine disconnects, 11% sin tax, and the total cost of buying into a new platform, another pistol feels more like an expensive sidegrade than an upgrade.




With all the newer polymer pistols available in the California market from brands like Sig, Walther, M&P, H&K, Springfield, and others, I keep asking myself if there is anything currently on the Roster that is actually worth getting.

For me, the answer so far has been no.

It is not because I am some hardcore Glock fanboy. I am not. I own and have shot other pistols as well, including CZ, H&K, Walther, Springfield, and Sig. There are plenty of good guns out there, and I can appreciate them for what they are. But when I started out, Glock simply made the most sense here in California. They were readily available, relatively affordable, reliable, and had strong third-party support. Over time, I ended up heavily investing in that ecosystem: magazines, holsters, optics setups, spare parts, and other support gear. More importantly, I have also invested a lot of training, practice, and competition time with Glocks. At this point, they just feel natural and seamless to run.

That is where I have trouble justifying a switch. I honestly do not see a significant performance difference with most of the latest service pistols. More or less, I can pick up a new pistol and, after one or two range trips, get close to the same accuracy, recoil management, and overall performance. Of course, doing it with Glocks feels easier and more automatic because of all the time already invested.

Then there is the magazine disconnects, and now the extra 11% sin tax on top of everything else. That makes it even harder to justify spending serious money on a new platform that does not really give me anything meaningfully better. It is not just the cost of the pistol. It is the magazines, holsters, optics setup, spare parts, and time needed to get equally comfortable with it. That adds up fast.

And with the magazine disconnect issue, I am not really interested in buying a new pistol just to start messing with internals. Personally, I prefer to keep my pistols mostly OEM stock. Aside from grip tape, slide milling, and optics, I do not really like changing internal parts just to make the gun feel normal or to get around California-mandated features.

So I have not bought a new handgun in a few years. Not because there is nothing good out there, but because I have not found anything that gives me a real enough advantage to justify buying into another platform. Maybe I am just bored. Or maybe the current California market is just kind of lackluster if you already have a setup that works.

At this point, instead of buying another polymer pistol that does more or less the same thing, especially with California making everything more expensive, I am starting to think I should just save up for a 2011 - and get something that actually feels like a different category altogether.

Thoughts?
All the off list and magazine disconnect is all bs and people are using them to exploit people and charge double or sometimes triple of what they paid for the pistols. My take on the aforementioned is account for the pistols strength and weaknesses and train - train - train and train!! Unless you are working in law enforcement or some other field that places you in a potential gunfight, go ahead and purchase a pistol without all the safety features. The chances of an average Joe getting into a gunfight is probably 1 in a million. If you purchase a reputable firearm arm that comes with the safety features that many people deem as a liability. The chances of one of the safety features failing is probably 1 in a million. Come on people don’t be stupid and allow yourself to be gouged and pay $1500 for an offlist Glock. What idiots, the people that fall into that trap!!
 
Hell, I put less rounds through any duty pistol I was ever issued than 99% of my fun guns. Could have been an SAA for all I ever had to use it. All I care about in a duty pistol is low upkeep, low weight and decent holsters.
 
What you are feeling is the burning desire to spend money on something nicer, maybe a Shadow 2 or maybe a 2011 just something SAO and hammer fired. I shoot strikers because they are easy to own but I enjoy shooting the hammers way more. But if you don't think they are worth the money and you still don't like the striker stuff then it just strikes me as you don't really enjoy pistols that much.


Shadow 2? Been there, done that.


After some chatter from another social media channel, I’m actually starting to consider a 2011… maybe the Fusion, as 1st cheaper alternative.


It’s not that I don’t enjoy pistols. I do. It’s just that the latest offerings don’t really excite me all that much, for lack of a better way to put it.
 
Shadow 2? Been there, done that.


After some chatter from another social media channel, I’m actually starting to consider a 2011… maybe the Fusion, as 1st cheaper alternative.


It’s not that I don’t enjoy pistols. I do. It’s just that the latest offerings don’t really excite me all that much, for lack of a better way to put it.
The Fusion is great, I absolutely love mine
 
Another vote for it!! I will be reaching out to 2A Zone soon.
You should put one in your hand before ordering one, the grip absolutely sucks and requires grip tape. It's definitely a downgrade in every way from a CZ. You will need to get a real 2011 to beat the performance of a CZ. The only reason to get a 2011 over a CZ is the modularity, you can change the grip/trigger/safety/etc on a 2011 to get exactly what you want, but the fusions don't allow that.
 
You should put one in your hand before ordering one, the grip absolutely sucks and requires grip tape. It's definitely a downgrade in every way from a CZ. You will need to get a real 2011 to beat the performance of a CZ. The only reason to get a 2011 over a CZ is the modularity, you can change the grip/trigger/safety/etc on a 2011 to get exactly what you want, but the fusions don't allow that.

Oh!!!! :oops: Dang!!! That means, I need to do more due diligence...


Which 2011 would you recommend?
 
Oh!!!! :oops: Dang!!! That means, I need to do more due diligence...


Which 2011 would you recommend?
Id get one of the kimbers that are coming onto the roster soon. the 4.25 pro royal has the mjd polymer grip that is very nice. The 5" target is also nice but comes with an aluminum grip that supposedly is not the best. But the beauty of the platform is you can switch it out to pretty much any grip you want from an atlas to a steel cheely. All it takes is $$$$$ lol.
 
For me, only thing newer additions got me are ultra compact 10 round ccw with optic options.
So sig p365 and s&w shield plus. This was the only gap for me.
S&W M&P 10 mm on the list (instead of milling g23sf-g3) when I decide to get optics for hiking.
That’s about it.
 
Personal preference and opinions aren’t facts.

1. The roster is, in fact, much better than what it used to be just 5 years ago (wasn’t hard to do admittedly).

2. Walther PDP and Springfield Echelon are, in fact, better than Glock in the features they offer, ergonomics and triggers.

Candid question:
Have you ever shot a P320, Echelon, and PDP? Do you have first-hand experience with the other things you talk about?


- Glock guys are the Harley equivalent of the motorcycle community - most riders know what I’m talking about 😂

It’s the insufferable bunch of harley guys that have never tried anything else in their lives, but are convinced Harleys are THE best bikes on Earth and everything else is “meh”.

You sound the same, convincing yourself going in circles while ignoring the good out there.

I say this as a Harley and Glock owner…
and owner of many other things.

Men should experience more and talk less.

Go buy an Echelon or PDP already (or else).
If you’re not broke in money, then why be willfully broke in mind?
 
Personal preference and opinions aren’t facts.

1. The roster is, in fact, much better than what it used to be just 5 years ago (wasn’t hard to do admittedly).

2. Walther PDP and Springfield Echelon are, in fact, better than Glock in the features they offer, ergonomics and triggers.

Candid question:
Have you ever shot a P320, Echelon, and PDP? Do you have first-hand experience with the other things you talk about?


- Glock guys are the Harley equivalent of the motorcycle community - most riders know what I’m talking about 😂

It’s the insufferable bunch of harley guys that have never tried anything else in their lives, but are convinced Harleys are THE best bikes on Earth and everything else is “meh”.

You sound the same, convincing yourself going in circles while ignoring the good out there.

I say this as a Harley and Glock owner…
and owner of many other things.

Men should experience more and talk less.

Go buy an Echelon or PDP already (or else).
If you’re not broke in money, then why be willfully broke in mind?
Cartman Cop GIF
 
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