Anyone else training scars going from striker fired back to SA/DA pistols

[Sheepdog1968]

Hi,
I the late 2000s, I extensively shot DA/SA pistols and took many training classes with them. I was very proficient with them and had no issues to speak of and really liked them. About 10 years ago, I kept these pistols for home defense use only and at the range for a decade shot Glocks. Rather recently, I’ve started shooting the DA/SA pistols again. I’m finding now that at least once per mag or two I don’t bring the trigger forward enough to reset it; I guess I’ve gotten used to the reset of my Glock. I will call this a training scar. At this point, I’ve probably put another 700 plus rounds through my DA/SA pistols again but still am having occasional issues. Has anyone else had this happen? If so, how did you fix/resolve it. I don’t mind the difference between a DA/SA pull. I don’t mind the factory Glock trigger. Almost feel like I might be better off choosing just one platform for range/CCW/home defense use. Thoughts?

Slightly related, I think it was Bill Roger’s who used to teach a class and was an advocate for bringing the trigger fully forward and not trying to ride the reset. The theory was it helped avoid some weapon to weapon differences especially if you were possibly using lot of firearms or t block weapons. That might be another approach. Thanks.

 

[ikeo1]

Slightly related, I think it was Bill Roger’s who used to teach a class and was an advocate for bringing the trigger fully forward and not trying to ride the reset. The theory was it helped avoid some weapon to weapon differences especially if you were possibly using lot of firearms or t block weapons. That might be another approach.

I don’t shoot SA/DA often but the approach is always to come off the trigger as much as possible to the point of almost slapping on fast doubles but main thing is practice with the firearm. If you’re at 700 rounds I’d go another 2-3k rounds and you should be back to normal. Otherwise dry fire is the way to get those reps on the trigger to get use to the feel again. I almost never ride the trigger back to reset because it’ll slow you down

 

[Smittty]

I prefer the deliberate DA/SA trigger and don’t have the issue you described.

If anything I’ll occasionally double tap when I intended to stage the trigger or shoot a little slower.

DA/SA guns I like the best are the Sig P226 and HK P2000. Never had issues and both are outstanding.

 

[Deleted member 16735]

Ive had some pretty light triggers on my ARs and PCCs which make them easy to bump fire, I think it's just good practice to not ride the reset for a number of reasons but avoiding a ND is one of them. I feel like you can be in much better control if you are intentionally taking your finger off the trigger.

 

[Hit Factor]

Ive had some pretty light triggers on my ARs and PCCs which make them easy to bump fire, I think it's just good practice to not ride the reset for a number of reasons but avoiding a ND is one of them.

Have you really ever unintentionally bump fired? I have Geissele S3Gs in the two ARs I use for multi-gun, and Geissele SD-3Gs in the two PCCs I use for USPSA and Steel Challenge. All four have the lightest spring available installed on them. I have NEVER had a negligent discharge with them, much less a bump fire, and I try very hard to keep my finger on the trigger while firing multiple shots as fast as I can. Nor have I ever seen anyone bump fire in any competition I’ve ever been to, and the majority of shooters there have very light triggers. I’m pretty sure that whatever you’re doing to cause these negligent discharges and unintentional bump fires can be worked out through dry fire.

I feel like you can be in much better control if you are intentionally taking your finger off the trigger.

If by “in much better control” you mean “significantly slower,” then I agree with you.

 

[ikeo1]

Have you really ever unintentionally bump fired? I have Geissele S3Gs in the two ARs I use for multi-gun, and Geissele SD-3Gs in the two PCCs I use for USPSA and Steel Challenge. All four have the lightest spring available installed on them. I have NEVER had a negligent discharge with them, much less a bump fire, and I try very hard to keep my finger on the trigger while firing multiple shots as fast as I can. Nor have I ever seen anyone bump fire in any competition I’ve ever been to, and the majority of shooters there have very light triggers. I’m pretty sure that whatever you’re doing to cause these negligent discharges and unintentional bump fires can be worked out through dry fire.


If by “in much better control” you mean “significantly slower,” then I agree with you.

I’ve seen a couple, Inifinity LO gun and an Atlas Chaos Open I believe. It’s rare though. The infinity I think was a part issue that once it got fixed didn’t happen. I forget what the issue exactly was

 

[Hit Factor]

I’ve seen a couple, Inifinity LO gun and an Atlas Chaos Open I believe. It’s rare though. The infinity I think was a part issue that once it got fixed didn’t happen. I forget what the issue exactly was

A gun malfunction, not operator error, right? I once had a PC Carbine go into full auto when I tried using a 10/22 trigger group in it. But I’m saying I’ve never seen anyone unintentionally bump fire a gun as a result of maintaining contact with the trigger while firing and resetting it.

 

[ikeo1]

A gun malfunction, not operator error, right? I once had a PC Carbine go into full auto when I tried using a 10/22 trigger group in it. But I’m saying I’ve never seen anyone unintentionally bump fire a gun as a result of maintaining contact with the trigger while firing and resetting it.

It happens, one was a gun issue tolerance. These have super light triggers though. I have seen a couple guys do it. The triggers are light. When the trigger is that light. It’s really rare though on super light triggers, if it’s > 1.5 lbs I don’t think it’s an issue unless it’s a defective part. Just saying I’ve seen it for a couple different reasons and times.

If you can ride the trigger and do fast splits, that’s never a bad thing. I’m still trying to get to reset faster on prep.

Thinking in a different way about this, would you say bill drill is a good practical drill for this? 2-3 rounds cold start. 18 rounds total low round count and should learn a bit from it if it’s on video.

 

[Hit Factor]

Thinking in a different way about this, would you say bill drill is a good practical drill for this? 2-3 rounds cold start. 18 rounds total low round count and should learn a bit from it if it’s on video.

Bill Drills are great for muzzle control, but you might just end up slapping the trigger since you’re concentrating on the sights and trying to shoot as fast as they allow. Instead, just take one shot, reset, and then prep the trigger for a follow-up shot as fast as you can. But then stop and evaluate instead of taking the follow up shot. Did your finger leave the trigger? If it did, do a few slow dry fire resets and then try it again. Keep doing it until resetting and prepping starts to feel natural. It might even help to use a timer and then prep the trigger and wait for the beep before shooting, resetting, and prepping once again. Once you feel good about this, you can start double tapping, but still make sure you prep the trigger at the same speed after the second shot. Not ending until after the follow-up prep is key. As I’m sure you know, concentrating on more than one thing at speed is difficult, so make sure you’re concentrating on what is happening with your trigger finger while you do this, and see if it helps. That’s what I do, anyway. Just remember: with free advice, you get what you pay for, and in this case you can even keep the change. But I hope it helps a little.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

I don’t shoot SA/DA often but the approach is always to come off the trigger as much as possible to the point of almost slapping on fast doubles but main thing is practice with the firearm. If you’re at 700 rounds I’d go another 2-3k rounds and you should be back to normal. Otherwise dry fire is the way to get those reps on the trigger to get use to the feel again. I almost never ride the trigger back to reset because it’ll slow you down

I didn’t think it might slow you down. I will have to try what you mentioned. Thanks.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

I prefer the deliberate DA/SA trigger and don’t have the issue you described.

If anything I’ll occasionally double tap when I intended to stage the trigger or shoot a little slower.

DA/SA guns I like the best are the Sig P226 and HK P2000. Never had issues and both are outstanding.

I never had a problem when I shot them exclusively. The problem started after I had shot Glocks a bunch. Do you also shoot striker fired pistols at all?

 

[Deleted member 16735]

Have you really ever unintentionally bump fired? I have Geissele S3Gs in the two ARs I use for multi-gun, and Geissele SD-3Gs in the two PCCs I use for USPSA and Steel Challenge. All four have the lightest spring available installed on them. I have NEVER had a negligent discharge with them, much less a bump fire, and I try very hard to keep my finger on the trigger while firing multiple shots as fast as I can. Nor have I ever seen anyone bump fire in any competition I’ve ever been to, and the majority of shooters there have very light triggers. I’m pretty sure that whatever you’re doing to cause these negligent discharges and unintentional bump fires can be worked out through dry fire.


If by “in much better control” you mean “significantly slower,” then I agree with you.

Yes that's why I said it, the PCC I had was super easy to do it to, it had a triggertech that was supposed to go down to 2.5 lbs but it felt even lighter. I set it higher and it pretty much went away but then it had reset issues so I took it out. My AR I did it during a PCSL match, tried to shoot a double and it tripled, the whole squad was like " was that on purpose??". With the AR I believe it was because it was my first shot after the timer and I started shooting before I was fully braced so it was a legit bump fire. If you are riding the reset and not fully braced you would definitely be more at risk of bump firing. Ive definitely seen other people in matches with PCCs do it, PCCs are way more prone to trigger issues due to the lack of lockup and the blowback action. You are talking about keeping your finger on the trigger but "riding the rest" is something reddit people do, it's not just keeping your finger on the trigger it's like keeping pressure on it and making the reset push your finger out. It doesn't work on an AR because of the design but on some pistols or an AK you can fully ride the reset. This phenomena is also literally in the USPSA rules 10.5.18

 

[aema15]

I train with and carry G19, G26, and CZ P-01. Aside from the difference in grip angle between Glock and CZ (or any other major platform for that matter), I have the worst time with the DA pull on my CZ. If I go too long (maybe a week?) without dry firing that gun, my double action pull becomes atrocious. It's such an uphill climb for me to be able to pull that trigger without disturbing the sights.

Sometimes I wonder why I put myself through such torture, being on the verge of rage quitting daily as opposed to just sticking to striker fired guns. Easy, simple, and consistent.

But no, I'm stubborn and feel the need to get good at the P-01 it because I already have it and can't bring myself to sell it (yet?).

 

[Joker67]

 

[Smittty]

I never had a problem when I shot them exclusively. The problem started after I had shot Glocks a bunch. Do you also shoot striker fired pistols at all?

I occasionally shoot an Xmacro and have no issues other than I feel the trigger is lighter with shorter reset than I would carry.

I like the G19 trigger better from that standpoint, it’s more deliberate.

Are triggers on new guns getting too light?

 

[Smittty]

I train with and carry G19, G26, and CZ P-01. Aside from the difference in grip angle between Glock and CZ (or any other major platform for that matter), I have the worst time with the DA pull on my CZ. If I go too long (maybe a week?) without dry firing that gun, my double action pull becomes atrocious. It's such an uphill climb for me to be able to pull that trigger without disturbing the sights.

Sometimes I wonder why I put myself through such torture, being on the verge of rage quitting daily as opposed to just sticking to striker fired guns. Easy, simple, and consistent.

But no, I'm stubborn and feel the need to get good at the P-01 it because I already have it and can't bring myself to sell it (yet?).

I went thru a CZ phase and owned almost every model, and today I don’t own any. I felt burned by them for every new gun needing a trigger job.

Now the most trigger work I’ll do is change a mainspring. If it needs more work than that I don’t want it.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

Thanks. Helps to explain exactly how to avoid riding the trigger back to reset like I’ve been doing.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

Just saw this training system with your own pistol. While not cheap, it may very well be a way I can easily practice at home.

CoolFire Trainer | Dry Fire Training Systems With Recoil

CoolFire Trainer

coolfiretrainer.com