California's new 11% excise tax on firearms and ammunition applies to private party transfers?!?!

[guncurious]

You don't pay the 11% on a PPT. You do pay it if buying used/consignment from the LGS. Whoever is telling you otherwise is an idiot or trying to take your money.

 

[SwieDonE]

Just did a few in the last 45 days and no tax. Turners will probably charge it just cuz..................

 

[Tere_Hanges]

OP, are you sure the dealers didn't think you were asking about consignment/used guns or dealer transfers? Those are not PPTs and are therefore subject to the 11% tax.

PPTs are exempt from both the 11% tax and the handgun roster.

 

[EL Pistolero]

What could be happening is that some FFL's have a policy that any transaction carried out inside their store PPT included is taxable be it Ca tax and now excise tax. Plus, now everything is both video and audio recorded.

 

[Scubabugdiver]

OP, are you sure the dealers didn't think you were asking about consignment/used guns or dealer transfers? Those are not PPTs and are therefore subject to the 11% tax.

PPTs are exempt from both the 11% tax and the handgun roster.

I was very clear on what I was trying to do over the phone. We both called around stores in Orange County because it was a half way meeting point. This actually cost me the sale on my Henry because the buyer didn’t want to pay the tax, and I don’t blame him.

 

[boltstop]

What could be happening is that some FFL's have a policy that any transaction carried out inside their store PPT included is taxable be it Ca tax and now excise tax. Plus, now everything is both video and audio recorded.

What is, and is not, taxable is not a matter of policy for individual FFLs - it is what is stipulated in the law.

 

[81Richskie]

I don’t understand what the FFL would be charging 11% on? I haven’t ever declared any value when conducting a Private party transfer. That’s BOGUS!

 

[Scubabugdiver]

That’s exactly what my biggest gripe is! What’s the supposed “value” based on? If this is going to be the norm, is condition, round count, etc a factor? Makes me cringe to think the state can decide a value of a firearm when they can’t even define what a “ assault rifle” is.

 

[cobian1984]

Have done numerous PPTs at various FFLs, including Turners, and never been charged sales tax or FET. I will say that doing a PPT at Turners might be the worst form of human torture there is. Never been able to get through one in under about an hour at any Turners. I second OC Guns as a good PPT spot. They were able to get through it in under 10 minutes.

 

[boltstop]

I’m looking to do a PPT with buyer today in Orange County and every single store we called , about ten, from Turners to small guns stores wants to charge us the %11 excise tax! Is this the new normal? And what, who or where determines the value of the firearm to base the %11 tax against? Is condition/wear and tear taken into consideration?

Do they also want to charge you sales tax?

 

[EL Pistolero]

I don't think all FFL employees care if it is the law or not, some turn a blind eye to what they don't care to deal with at that moment, others are all text book. If their "policy" says to tax, they tax...if they don't tax then they don't tax.

 

[ddesoto10]

I’m looking to do a PPT with buyer today in Orange County and every single store we called , about ten, from Turners to small guns stores wants to charge us the %11 excise tax! Is this the new normal? And what, who or where determines the value of the firearm to base the %11 tax against? Is condition/wear and tear taken into consideration?

Soo why can't you just say that you paid/ sold it for less like you do when you sell a car private party. In order to save the buyer money

 

[westsidearms]

Soo why can't you just say that you paid/ sold it for less like you do when you sell a car private party. In order to save the buyer money

First, PPTs are not retail sales and so there is no tax of any sort collected on them. So it really is a non-issue.

Second, in the case of transfers where sales and CFET must be collected, you must provide a receipt showing what you paid. If it seems unreasonable, I would just decline the transfer. When the proper tax is not collected, it is 100% the retailer's liability and it will be the retailer that must pay the penalties and interest if it is found that tax is due. There is no requirement to collect the tax; only to pay it. So if the dealer does not collect the tax, there is zero obligation that at a later time the customer must pay it. Only the dealer must pay it.

So as a dealer, I have zero interest in attempting to help you stick me with the tax bill for your retail sale. If in doubt, I will just tell you to do your transfer elsewhere. If someone else is willing to take on your tax liability, more power to them.

 

[Bakerloo]

I did a PPT on a $5000 shotgun at Turner's in Fresno last week. $47.19 out the door and it was done with amazing efficiency. I had never been inside a Turner's, so I was expecting a nightmare (from what I've read) but it was a great place on a Sunday morning at 10 AM.

 

[joefrank64k]

I did a PPT on a $5000 shotgun at Turner's in Fresno last week. $47.19 out the door and it was done with amazing efficiency. I had never been inside a Turner's, so I was expecting a nightmare (from what I've read) but it was a great place on a Sunday morning at 10 AM.

I've found that that's the secret for Turners...get there right when they open for anything, PPT or retail sale. I try to stay away from them, but every so often they have a price on something that just can't be beat.

Also, I discovered that they price match. Another FFL quite a drive from me had an amazing price on a Beretta PX4 in .40 S&W. I went to the Turners that's about 10 min from me and they priced matched, no problem. Saved me two long drives to the other FFL, haha!!

 

[tedster]

I did a PPT on a $5000 shotgun at Turner's in Fresno last week. $47.19 out the door and it was done with amazing efficiency. I had never been inside a Turner's, so I was expecting a nightmare (from what I've read) but it was a great place on a Sunday morning at 10 AM.

That's good experience.
With Turner's it much depends on the location and who is working there.
They are employees, some have an attitude others are real cool and efficient at what they do.

 

[DuckDawg22]

Wouldn't at all surprise me to find out Turner's is telling people bad info over the phone to avoid doing PPTs

 

[tedster]

I've found that that's the secret for Turners...get there right when they open for anything, PPT or retail sale. I try to stay away from them, but every so often they have a price on something that just can't be beat.

Also, I discovered that they price match. Another FFL quite a drive from me had an amazing price on a Beretta PX4 in .40 S&W. I went to the Turners that's about 10 min from me and they priced matched, no problem. Saved me two long drives to the other FFL, haha!!

Turner's has an online listing for their "Consignment Rack". As I mentioned in another post, I am a market place junkie.
It's great to search their listing, you can filter by brand or location. Sometimes something is there real interesting, price wise.
Recently I found out they can sell out of another store. After you bought the firearm they will transfer it to your location and DROS it there.
Of course everything that goes thru the retail store will have local sales tax and excise tax.
Per my rule of thumb it's approximately 20% added to the price of the item for both tax positions.

 

[tedster]

Wouldn't at all surprise me to find out Turner's is telling people bad info over the phone to avoid doing PPTs

Never saw that happen and I did a solid number of PPTs at their stores in a variety of locations throughout SoCal.

One thing though I have to say, they overpriced a consignment rifle by literrally 2x of what that long gun was sold new for (w/scope package)
People bought that Rem 783 at $299 new, just to get the action and re-barreled with a quality barrel and tuned the action.

Not cool on Turner's part and stupid on my part to buy the thing for double than what it was new.

 

[DuckDawg22]

Never saw that happen and I did a solid number of PPTs at their stores in a variety of locations throughout SoCal.

One thing though I have to say, they overpriced a consignment rifle by literrally 2x of what that long gun was sold new for (w/scope package)
People bought that Rem 783 at $299 new, just to get the action and re-barreled with a quality barrel and tuned the action.

Not cool on Turner's part and stupid on my part to buy the thing for double than what it was new.

As others have said, depends on the store. The boys behind the counter at the Stockton store basically want to see your Amex before even looking at the gun you're asking to see. They had a sale on Phenix fishing rods that got me in the store, but I was not left wanting to give them any gun business.