First AR-15 budget/learning build, thoughts on these PSA uppers?

[steves86ta]

If you're looking for budget. Bear Creek arsenal have been solid for me.

You will want to at least rebuild the bolt or buy a decent aftermarket bcg/bolt

 

[Slammed01]

So best to pickup a wheeler or real avid kit or piece one? I do like the wheeler with trigger guard tool and bolt pin, could be nice for future builds.

I see there is a knockoff wheeler for $28 but some say a blemmed wheeler.
Any thoughts on these kits? Learn and upgrade ..

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Damn that's a steal, I have 2 on order with sportmans warehouse for $43.99 price match hmmmm. Maybe they will adjust, I. An DROS 2 lowers with one fee right?

Yes, put both lowers on one dros so you can only be charged for the one dros.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

So best to pickup a wheeler or real avid kit or piece one? I do like the wheeler with trigger guard tool and bolt pin, could be nice for future builds.

I see there is a knockoff wheeler for $28 but some say a blemmed wheeler.
Any thoughts on these kits? Learn and upgrade ..

Real avid is nicer quality. Wheeler is not bad either. Don’t get the knock off; unless this is something like a one and done situation. Since you mentioned future builds get the not knock off.

I’ve used the wheeler trigger guard tool before and there was this little cushion that the adhesive failed. I ended up returning it on Amazon prime. But I’m pretty sure wheeler would send out a new one if you asked about warranty; since that meant a bad adhesive job.

If you are ordering that lower that doesn’t have an integrated trigger guard you will need a trigger guard tool. I would not recommend using a punch to drive it in. People have poo poo’d before and screw up their lower that way.

 

[Slammed01]

Real avid is nicer quality. Wheeler is not bad either. Don’t get the knock off; unless this is something like a one and done situation. Since you mentioned future builds get the not knock off.

I’ve used the wheeler trigger guard tool before and there was this little cushion that the adhesive failed. I ended up returning it on Amazon prime. But I’m pretty sure wheeler would send out a new one if you asked about warranty; since that meant a bad adhesive job.

If you are ordering that lower that doesn’t have an integrated trigger guard you will need a trigger guard tool. I would not recommend using a punch to drive it in. People have poo poo’d before and screw up their lower that way.

Thank you. May get the wheeler then and I can always upgrade the punches later.

Trigger tool is $30 by itself, and bolt tool is $12. I could see using a handful of times a year or so. Good starter kit it seems and buy a block...Ive seen those post with snapped ears

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

If you're looking for budget. Bear Creek arsenal have been solid for me.

You will want to at least rebuild the bolt or buy a decent aftermarket bcg/bolt

No, he is looking for defensive use as well. I wouldn’t recommend it. BCA, if it was just for plinking or hunting. Now, counter argument is if he has a bear creek arsenal upper that works; not bad either. But if he was going to change out the nitride bolt supplied by bca; he might as well just went with the psa upper in the first place. BCA hasn’t been known for good quality control.

I have two bca uppers that I bought in the past I needed to send in to have the second one come back right. Both uppers for the first and also warranty return had handguard screws that were not even all the way screwed in; i needed to tighten them myself and then torque to 35 inch pounds.

The first one was 5.56 1:9 twist 16 inch barrel that I wanted just for hunting mountain jackrabbits and also a little plinking, it would scratch the round every time a new round was chambered. You can tell because if you wanted to unload, there was some tension in pulling the charging handle and there would be a scratch on the actual bullet. I sent that one in; the second one runs good but I don’t run it hard.

Second one was 16 inch 7.62x39 upper for wild pigs and also a little plinking. It was so hard to pull the charging handle back to unload where I needed to rip it back; I had once where my finger nail ripped. I sent that back, second one works; but the firing pin chipped after 40 rounds of steel case Tula. Replacements broke again. I ended up upgrading the firing pin to a black rifle arms which is rated for steel case.

So, both uppers work now. But I wouldn’t use any of those uppers for defense knowing that I had issues like that in the first place; however, it could also just be me thinking that since those uppers are dedicated hunting uppers. That’s just me. However, they do have a good price point.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Thank you. May get the wheeler then and I can always upgrade the punches later.

Trigger tool is $30 by itself, and bolt tool is $12. I could see using a handful of times a year or so. Good starter kit it seems and buy a block...Ive seen those post with snapped ears

Roll punchs are a little more forgiving for not marring; but you could just use those punches with a light wrap of blue masking tape.

For punch for staking; you want a 5/32. This one by mayhew is good. https://a.co/d/7hLgW5j

 

[Slammed01]

Roll punchs are a little more forgiving for not marring; but you could just use those punches with a light wrap of blue masking tape.

For punch for staking; you want a 5/32. This one by mayhew is good. https://a.co/d/7hLgW5jView attachment 30773

Appreciate this! I'll add to cart, once my lowers get to sportsman's time to order some tools! Painters tape is on the list too

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Appreciate this! I'll add to cart, once my lowers get to sportsman's time to order some tools! Painters tape is on the list too

What are you using for castle nut wrench?

 

[Slammed01]

What are you using for castle nut wrench?

Going to browse Amazon idk I see a lot of the armorers wrenches on there or someone selling Magpul for $65 here.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Going to browse Amazon idk I see a lot of the armorers wrenches on there or someone selling Magpul for $65 here.

If it’s a castle nut wrench on the opposite other long end side of the torque wrench, the magpul is a good example, there is a mathematical formula where it’s actually less than the actual foot pounds because if you just go straight with 40 foot pounds, it will actually turn out to be more than 40 foot pounds because you are actually using it like a breaker bar.

AR-15 Castle Nut Torque Calculation | Adiga Armory

This is a quick AR-15 build tip on how to calculate and account for the added length of your castle nut/armorers tool when setting your torque wrench.

adigaarmory.com

If the castle nut wrench tool is right next to the torque wrench female adapter hole, then clock the castle nut wrench at a 90 degree angle when torquing instead of directly straight where it’s also like a breaker bar. A real avid crows foot wrench or real avid master wrench is a good example. For this style, you do not need to do the mathematical formula; as long as you clock it at a 90 degree angle before torquing.

Here is a video of the example.

Appreciate this! I'll add to cart, once my lowers get to sportsman's time to order some tools! Painters tape is on the list too

Good video on the technique of staking from Brownells to prevent poo pooing such as nicking, denting, or marring.

If you already have a torque wrench, want to save some money, instead of buying a whole combo wrench, there is the option of a real avid crows foot wrench for $30. Their master wrench (combo wrench) is $80.

https://realavid.com/products/master-fit-wrench-heads?variant=45351094583453&country=US¤cy=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&srsltid=AfmBOop-i_4BEsKifZF3NvsjCAk-pbabwVvQ24ECT3n9KEVt98hqANRDcMg&gQT=2

Armorer's Master Wrench®

Professional-grade armorer's wrench with ergonomic design Multi-function tool includes 5 specialized wrenches 10-post free-float barrel nut wrench for superior strength Integrated 1/2" torque wrench receiver for precision Converts to hammer with 3 interchangeable heads

realavid.com

 

[Slammed01]

I do have the Harbor Freight 1/2" already so I'll look into what you linked, thank you for breaking it down.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

I do have the Harbor Freight 1/2" already so I'll look into what you linked, thank you for breaking it down.

Yeh, that’ll work just fine. I also use a torque wrench I use for working on my vehicle as well. I use Tekton.

Those 6 ton jackstands at Harbor Freight are pretty nice to use when working on a suv or truck; bought it on a good sale. I like that second tab lock feature they have for the jackstands. I use their 3 ton low profile super duty candy apple metallic red car jack too; it’s nice and raises high enough for SUV and trucks.

 

[Slammed01]

Yeh, that’ll work just fine. I also use a torque wrench I use for working on my vehicle as well. I use Tekton.

Those 6 ton jackstands at Harbor Freight are pretty nice to use when working on a suv or truck; bought it on a good sale. I like that second tab lock feature they have for the jackstands. I use their 3 ton low profile super duty candy apple metallic red car jack too; it’s nice and raises high enough for SUV and trucks.

I have their OG low profile jack and 3 ton stands (not the recalled ones lol I checked!) heard great things about the tekton too, may grab one for a 3/8".

I was happy when they opened a store 2 miles from me, now all this tool talk I want to go support them lol. Thought about grabbing tools from there as a "build kit" but think I'll go the wheeler for the speciality tools and see what I actually use then expand.

 

[steves86ta]

No, he is looking for defensive use as well. I wouldn’t recommend it. BCA, if it was just for plinking or hunting. Now, counter argument is if he has a bear creek arsenal upper that works; not bad either. But if he was going to change out the nitride bolt supplied by bca; he might as well just went with the psa upper in the first place. BCA hasn’t been known for good quality control.

I have two bca uppers that I bought in the past I needed to send in to have the second one come back right. Both uppers for the first and also warranty return had handguard screws that were not even all the way screwed in; i needed to tighten them myself and then torque to 35 inch pounds.

The first one was 5.56 1:9 twist 16 inch barrel that I wanted just for hunting mountain jackrabbits and also a little plinking, it would scratch the round every time a new round was chambered. You can tell because if you wanted to unload, there was some tension in pulling the charging handle and there would be a scratch on the actual bullet. I sent that one in; the second one runs good but I don’t run it hard.

Second one was 16 inch 7.62x39 upper for wild pigs and also a little plinking. It was so hard to pull the charging handle back to unload where I needed to rip it back; I had once where my finger nail ripped. I sent that back, second one works; but the firing pin chipped after 40 rounds of steel case Tula. Replacements broke again. I ended up upgrading the firing pin to a black rifle arms which is rated for steel case.

So, both uppers work now. But I wouldn’t use any of those uppers for defense knowing that I had issues like that in the first place; however, it could also just be me thinking that since those uppers are dedicated hunting uppers. That’s just me. However, they do have a good price point.

Interesting - I am on my third upper from them and other than the bolts being crap they have all been great. The first one i bought was a 20" stainless 223 wylde and the gas rings didn't last long at all. I replaced the whole bolt/bcg and probably put well over 2500 rounds through it before selling it to a friend. It's in OK now and he still shoots it to this day.

that same 20" stainless one i took to an f-class match one time and shot a 600y match with it. It didnt do 'bad'. My F-class gun was being rebarreled at the time and i wanted to shoot so i took what i had available.

Did i shoot a 200 no... but i think i shot somewhere in the 170's or 180's and honestly for that gun, the wind we usually have at that range was way more than expected. And it was kind of fun shooting something that 'shouldn't' be there

I will say that i have gone through all three after i received them to cerakote them. Which meant a complete teardown and rebuild so that might help i'm not sure

i 100% would use either of the two i still have for a defensive gun and not worry about it. They have all ran great after bolt replacements. To be fair, the two others have not had bolt failures - i have replaced before even firing them one time.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Yeh, I remember the recall on the old 3 tons jackstands were something about splitting at the welded areas.

Tekton 3/8 would be $39 on Amazon prime. Craftsman’s 3/8 would be $55; more comfortable with the rubber grip.

For 1/2” I have the craftsman but the lowest torque is 50 foot pounds for their newer models; I use that for higher torque specs such as cranking down axle nuts to 243-248 foot pounds. The comfort grip comes in handy at that point. I had the old school craftsman 1/2 inch drive that went down to 26? Foot pounds but the grip wore out and kept slipping.

Downside of craftsman torque wrench warranty is 1 year; Tekton is lifetime.

Wera tools are really good too. German brand but manufactured in Czech. Wiha is their sister brother brand at a lower price. Kind of like Aero precision and ballistic advantage.

If you need a 1/4 inch bit holder for 1/4 inch drive ratchet that locks the bit with a quick release , this one by pro tools is good because you can turn with your finger to start screws. The Wera bit holder is nicer but it freely spins if you try to spin with your finger. Snap-on doesn’t make a locking one, it’s only magnetic, and it’s $25 just for that; it comes in handy once in awhile.

Yeh, it’s nice to have a HF nearby. Their 3/8 and 1/2 inch drive breaker bars are not bad either. Good for cracking loose suspension bolts and axle nuts.

Amazon.com

Amazon.com

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Interesting - I am on my third upper from them and other than the bolts being crap they have all been great. The first one i bought was a 20" stainless 223 wylde and the gas rings didn't last long at all. I replaced the whole bolt/bcg and probably put well over 2500 rounds through it before selling it to a friend. It's in OK now and he still shoots it to this day.

that same 20" stainless one i took to an f-class match one time and shot a 600y match with it. It didnt do 'bad'. My F-class gun was being rebarreled at the time and i wanted to shoot so i took what i had available.

Did i shoot a 200 no... but i think i shot somewhere in the 170's or 180's and honestly for that gun, the wind we usually have at that range was way more than expected. And it was kind of fun shooting something that 'shouldn't' be there

I will say that i have gone through all three after i received them to cerakote them. Which meant a complete teardown and rebuild so that might help i'm not sure

i 100% would use either of the two i still have for a defensive gun and not worry about it. They have all ran great after bolt replacements. To be fair, the two others have not had bolt failures - i have replaced before even firing them one time.

They sent you a new bolt or you had to buy one? They should have covered you with their warranty.

 

[steves86ta]

They sent you a new bolt or you had to buy one? They should have covered you with their warranty.

I never asked.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

I have their OG low profile jack and 3 ton stands (not the recalled ones lol I checked!) heard great things about the tekton too, may grab one for a 3/8".

I was happy when they opened a store 2 miles from me, now all this tool talk I want to go support them lol. Thought about grabbing tools from there as a "build kit" but think I'll go the wheeler for the speciality tools and see what I actually use then expand.

This is also a good castle nut wrench; it’s by tango down. It helps with preventing slipping.

I use the real avid master wrench and the tango down one for castle nut.

TangoDown AR-15 Castle Nut Wrench

AR-15, Wrench,

tangodown.com

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

Interesting - I am on my third upper from them and other than the bolts being crap they have all been great. The first one i bought was a 20" stainless 223 wylde and the gas rings didn't last long at all. I replaced the whole bolt/bcg and probably put well over 2500 rounds through it before selling it to a friend. It's in OK now and he still shoots it to this day.

that same 20" stainless one i took to an f-class match one time and shot a 600y match with it. It didnt do 'bad'. My F-class gun was being rebarreled at the time and i wanted to shoot so i took what i had available.

Did i shoot a 200 no... but i think i shot somewhere in the 170's or 180's and honestly for that gun, the wind we usually have at that range was way more than expected. And it was kind of fun shooting something that 'shouldn't' be there

I will say that i have gone through all three after i received them to cerakote them. Which meant a complete teardown and rebuild so that might help i'm not sure

i 100% would use either of the two i still have for a defensive gun and not worry about it. They have all ran great after bolt replacements. To be fair, the two others have not had bolt failures - i have replaced before even firing them one time.

The complete tear down might have helped; gives the chance to do your own QC.