Ported / compd guns and the dangers of shooting them in self defense

[Skilly]

And tell you they have candy in the van; so you better get in

So youre saying this is NOT free candy? Ok...note to self.

 

[GoldensRule]

Sir in this house we grab the rifle as god and Clint intended

"rifle" / 12 gauge shotgun

 

[Experimentalist]

Comps can throw gas and noise at your face but will not throw shrapnel. Their effect on accuracy is minimal, but the increased bulk makes them harder to carry and holster compatibility is an issue.

Ports on the other hand are cut into the rifled section of the barrel and can cut pieces of the jacket off as the bullet re-engages and ejecting it as shrapnel. This can also affect accuracy as the bullet is no longer concentric when it leaves the barrel. These can be worked around by backboring the barrel if the porting is at the end of it, but this also reduces the recoil reduction.

Both options can affect cycling reliability as they reduce the kinetic energy in the slide.

My g19 sized carry guns are unported but I do have an m&p shield 4 inch ported and backbored for tighter fitting clothing. The shield has more recoil and excessive cycling energy, making the trade off worth it to me.

My understanding of the topic is far from encyclopedic, here's my best understanding:

Your points about comps is spot on. Appropriately engineered they throw gas and noise but not shrapnel.

Ports essentially are holes in the barrel and come in a range of sizes.

The key issue regarding shrapnel is the size of a particular port, which is to say the degree to which the bullet is unsupported as it passes by the port.

A quick thought experiment: If I have a port in a barrel that's a micron in diameter, the bullet won't even notice it. As we make that port larger at some point the bullet experiences a lack of mechanical support. Additionally the bullet will be forced to re-engrave itself to some degree on the rifling found at the other end of that port. If the opposite end of that port isn't back-bored as you describe then the bullet will engrave itself on this at an odd angle - potentially scraping some of the bullet jacket off and thus generating fragments hazardous to those in the area. Of course the port becomes more efficient (to a point) the larger it is, which enables more propellant gasses to be redirected upwards instead of forwards and thus shifts the momentum equations a bit more in the shooters favor.

Back boring does of course reduce efficiency, but as I noted in a different post these compromises can be managed to acceptable levels in a properly engineered system - just as they are with compensators, which by design are bored to a diameter sufficient to clear the bullet.

Hoping this helps clarify some things. The small ports one finds with MagnaPorting, for example, are not going to throw fragments. Hot gas and noise yes, but not fragments. MagnaPort example: https://magnaport.com/hgun.html

 

[Jimi Jah]

Use a heavier gun or strengthen your grip and you won't need a ported barrel.

 

[jhsd20]

My understanding of the topic is far from encyclopedic, here's my best understanding:

Your points about comps is spot on. Appropriately engineered they throw gas and noise but not shrapnel.

Ports essentially are holes in the barrel and come in a range of sizes.

The key issue regarding shrapnel is the size of a particular port, which is to say the degree to which the bullet is unsupported as it passes by the port.

A quick thought experiment: If I have a port in a barrel that's a micron in diameter, the bullet won't even notice it. As we make that port larger at some point the bullet experiences a lack of mechanical support. Additionally the bullet will be forced to re-engrave itself to some degree on the rifling found at the other end of that port. If the opposite end of that port isn't back-bored as you describe then the bullet will engrave itself on this at an odd angle - potentially scraping some of the bullet jacket off and thus generating fragments hazardous to those in the area. Of course the port becomes more efficient (to a point) the larger it is, which enables more propellant gasses to be redirected upwards instead of forwards and thus shifts the momentum equations a bit more in the shooters favor.

Back boring does of course reduce efficiency, but as I noted in a different post these compromises can be managed to acceptable levels in a properly engineered system - just as they are with compensators, which by design are bored to a diameter sufficient to clear the bullet.

Hoping this helps clarify some things. The small ports one finds with MagnaPorting, for example, are not going to throw fragments. Hot gas and noise yes, but not fragments. MagnaPort example: https://magnaport.com/hgun.html

I dont think you're wrong in any way conceptually. A lot of times shrapnel in ports can be very ammo dependent as well, one ammo type that does not fragments does not mean all ammo types won't. If a port is drilled in the middle of the flat lands of the rifling, chances of shrapnel are less. If it is drilled on the edge of the rifling there will be sharp hooks visible. Unfortunately there's no way to know how the rifling looks on the other side of the barrel as you drill that I know of or is commonly done.

As for heavier guns and grip strength... sometimes I dont want to carry a heavier (thicker) gun and my grip strength only gets weaker with age. Having a workaround to a problem doesn't mean we shouldn't try to solve it. Thats the definition of stagnation.

 

[W.H.O.]

Believe it or not you could end up in close quarters struggle with someone. A robbery for example, at either knife or gunpoint where you have to prevent them from gaining control of your firearm. They may or may not have the intent to kill you but your life is in danger. You’ll have to create enough distance/positioning and earn the draw.

Could just be me, but I find the idea of being held at knifepoint objectively more terrifying than being held at gunpoint.

In either case, big brain move is to not look like your worth robbing at all.

I wonder if there's a market for deployable bum stank to dissuade would-be robbers....

 

[BillSmith]

Could just be me, but I find the idea of being held at knifepoint objectively more terrifying than being held at gunpoint.

Thought I was one-of-one. In my case, threat of being sliced produces a very visceral reaction. Have said that if someone was approaching me with a gun, I'm willing to follow the Prime Directive and negotiate. Holding a blade? I'm ending that threat with extreme prejudice, though now days, I am more a threat to suffocate an attacker.

 

[jhsd20]

Could just be me, but I find the idea of being held at knifepoint objectively more terrifying than being held at gunpoint.

In either case, big brain move is to not look like your worth robbing at all.

I wonder if there's a market for deployable bum stank to dissuade would-be robbers....

Its not you, it feels more dangerous and IS more dangerous. A knife at distances where it can reach you is much harder to take control of and disable.

We also tried practicing knife disarm using sharpies as knives and boy did we get marked up...

Not being worth attacking is indeed the biggest brain move in self defense.

 

[couragewolf]

Could the flak generating port on the end of your pistol supplement the pistols offensive value rather than make the pistol more dangerous to use if you apply the pistol appropriately?

 

[Gryff]

I’ve noticed a lot of people jumping into the ported / compd wagon and would like to open a discussion on actually carry them.

Not only are the chances of going deaf from shooting one in a confined space but shooting it from retention (close to your body) can cause shrapnel hitting the shooter in the body,face,eyes

Highly recommend shooting under some cardboard and testing all your ammo to see the results as each gun can very.


Also accuracy is always effected by comps and ports.

While I think the need for a comp on a 9mm Luger gun is a joke, there is a lot of FUD in here.