Poll PPT escrow service

[BONECUTR]

Sales tax could be interesting. Since they are paying you and you are paying the seller unlike a normally PPT where you are not involved in any transfer of funds sales and use tax does not need to be collected but by offering this service while being an FFL you might need to also be collecting tax and might need a secondhand dealer license.

Not sure.

 

[30tokens]

It is a big risk if you accept credit cards since then you need to figure out what you are going to do if the buyer disputes the credit card charge, especially since it is likely that the credit card company would find for the buyer (item not delivered to the buyer's address). There are a lot of stories by FFL and credit card disputes.

Getting a FFL is good in theory, but in practice it can be another story. Learning all of the issues is a major aspect: federal law, state law, sales tax issues, etc.

This would also mean more work for the FFL as they would have to inform you when the firearm is delivered. The buyer could also let you know as well.

Kemasa just brought an interesting point, correct me but any other 03 FFL requires 24/7 video surveillance on the whole premises. That leads to subpoenas as material in full. @raellic how would you go about practice and client privacy and privilege?

 

[H. Bowman]

Depending on cost per transaction, I'd use it. It would likely make a few more people willing to buy/sell via mail instead of only in person where they're so worried about getting robbed.

 

[raellic]

Kemasa just brought an interesting point, correct me but any other 03 FFL requires 24/7 video surveillance on the whole premises. That leads to subpoenas as material in full. @raellic how would you go about practice and client privacy and privilege?

That sucks, but it's solvable-- I actually have two equal-sized suites, and I can put the operation and video in the one where I don't see clients.

 

[riceman]

I wish there was a way for someone like me in Northern Norcal who finds an off-roster handgun but it's in Socal to be able to buy PPT somehow without having to travel a very long distance. Heck years ago, I drove 2 hrs one way to buy a Jerry Miculek 625 and 10 days later do it again, Total 8 hrs on the road. It was worth it at the time.

 

[couragewolf]

Correct. The problem this also solves is the buyer and seller having to be in the same place at the same time. PC 28050 does not require this, but practically speaking, every non-consignment dealer requires it and there was until now no easy way to give payment, examine the gun, and do the transaction all at the same time. Two trips to the dealer minimum.

I’m not understanding why this all doesn’t just happen at the FFL doing the deal?

I’ve done tons of these transfers and never had a single problem other than the occasional haggling once they’ve actually seen the gun.

 

[phonso302]

Is there actually a ppt problem with people not paying? I done a bunch of ppt and never had a issue. Seller shows up, shows item,I hand over cash and we walk in to do transfer. Vice versa when I have sold items, some people prefer to hand over cash when the transaction is complete. I could understand this service so for some 1 of type gun or super expensive firearm but for a run of the mill Glock or sig?

 

[BONECUTR]

Is there actually a ppt problem with people not paying? I done a bunch of ppt and never had a issue. Seller shows up, shows item,I hand over cash and we walk in to do transfer. Vice versa when I have sold items, some people prefer to hand over cash when the transaction is complete. I could understand this service so for some 1 of type gun or super expensive firearm but for a run of the mill Glock or sig?

He stated it was more aimed at high dollar items or something like an estate purchase..... I just did a 72 guns estate transfer. In this case if the person who inherited them didnt want them they might be looking for a buyer to take them all so someone might need to max out a credit card or two.

 

[adrkwan]

I would definitely use the service. I think I would have PPTed a Shadow 2, Shadow 2 Compact, DWX, and Platypus over the last 12 months had they been available without two fieldtrips to SoCal.

 

[phonso302]

I would definitely use the service. I think I would have PPTed a Shadow 2, Shadow 2 Compact, DWX, and Platypus over the last 12 months had they been available without two fieldtrips to SoCal.

Who would his service cut down on the trips? You have to show up and start dros in person and you have to show up to pick up the firearms.

 

[adrkwan]

Who would his service cut down on the trips? You have to show up and start dros in person and you have to show up to pick up the firearms.

Yup, his office is near my work. I would show up to do the paperwork in NorCal without having to take a trip down to SoCal.

 

[NeilDown]

Applaud the initiative. But there are too many complications IMO. Many sellers say they'll keep X% for failed DROS. If buyer puts funds into escrow and seller says they're out of town for a month, then what? If buyer is not happy with the condition of the gun at PPT, how does that get resolved?

 

[GAAPlebees]

Yup, his office is near my work. I would show up to do the paperwork in NorCal without having to take a trip down to SoCal.

That no longer sounds like a PPT

 

[adrkwan]

That no longer sounds like a PPT

My mistake. Sounds like it wouldn't be useful for my use case then.

 

[Deleted member 16735]

Applaud the initiative. But there are too many complications IMO. Many sellers say they'll keep X% for failed DROS. If buyer puts funds into escrow and seller says they're out of town for a month, then what? If buyer is not happy with the condition of the gun at PPT, how does that get resolved?

Yeah private sales are "as is" unlike retail, when the gun leaves my possession I need the money and there's no refunds for buyers remorse or any other reason for that matter. I do get it for high dollar transactions though maybe, but that's something I will never be a part of haha

 

[couragewolf]

Escrow generally implies there’s some risk of the buyer not having the funds to engage the seller and therefore proof of those funds is required to enable someone to go to the trouble of attempting the transaction and starting the DROS.

The niche sale I think this covers is mentioned above very high value transfers estate sales etc.

I don’t really understand why someone selling a firearm for less than probably 5k or so would even bother.

 

[H. Bowman]

Is there actually a ppt problem with people not paying? I done a bunch of ppt and never had a issue. Seller shows up, shows item,I hand over cash and we walk in to do transfer. Vice versa when I have sold items, some people prefer to hand over cash when the transaction is complete. I could understand this service so for some 1 of type gun or super expensive firearm but for a run of the mill Glock or sig?

I thought it was for shipped sales. I wouldn't bother with an in-person transaction. Why the hell would escrow be considered for that? Show up with cash/the item, inspect, hand over/receive cash, part ways. Whatever paperwork is needed can be done during/after that.

Doing it for in-person transactions just sounds like an opportunity for someone to get buyers remorse and be a pain in the ass.

 

[ef9boy88]

How often does PPT dispute come up?
For me the the service is valuable for two cases: 1. DROS didn't pass so gun/money goes back to buyer/seller. 2. Ability to ship the gun for PPT from other areas in CA.

I'd love the service if both can be resolved and for myself mostly as a buyer would be the ability to access markets outside of immediate area such as access to PPT in SoCal. However as FFL is required, do they charge more than the regular PPT or would they charge extra $100 on top of the PPT? If so you would probably need several partner FFLs (NorCal, SoCal, etc) to ship/receive PPTs by mail and can lower the FFL transfer fee on top of the PPT.

The FFL woild charge whatever their fee is for transfer on top of DROS and possibly sales tax.

 

[ef9boy88]

Sounds like a good move for people who are in different parts of the state.

 

[2seater]

This is a California company that has a business that provides kind of an escrow service. https://www.mtmccoyauctions.com/ In addition to selling they will pick up the firearms as they travel California weekly. I think they do a good job taking photos and giving descriptions which they have a new auction every 2 weeks which you can review on gun broker... https://www.gunbroker.com/All/search?IncludeSellers=423027 They are in Simi Valley, I think it would be GREAT for someone to open a NorCal office with them which would to make the PPT more convenient for NorCal.