Any Other Weapon (AOW)s in 2026?

[M_N04H]

I can put my M18 into a chassis? How does that work

I've no experience personally with the p320, but isn't it like an FCU system like the p365 and COG like the Echelon? Pull that fcu out and swap the grip, or into a chassis.

For comparison, since I do have an Echelon, I'm trying to get this, just need to find a place that can get it for me.

Strike SMC Bravo Chassis for Springfield Echelon 4.5

www.strikeindustries.com

 

[Gawernator]

I've no experience personally with the p320, but isn't it like an FCU system like the p365 and COG like the Echelon? Pull that fcu out and swap the grip, or into a chassis.

For comparison, since I do have an Echelon, I'm trying to get this, just need to find a place that can get it for me.

Strike SMC Bravo Chassis for Springfield Echelon 4.5

www.strikeindustries.com

Oh I see, that one is simpler and no front grip

 

[M_N04H]

Oh I see, that one is simpler and no front grip

That's where the AOW / Form 1 comes in

 

[Gawernator]

That's where the AOW / Form 1 comes in

then why are people saying it's an illegal AW config? I don't get it

 

[M_N04H]

then why are people saying it's an illegal AW config? I don't get it

It gets complicated with the ones that can convert to rifles. IIRC, once converted to rifles, pistols can never go back to a pistol configuration. This is more towards the AR stuff. My AR pistol started out as AR pistol, was never a rifle. So for an AR pistol, if you throw on a rifle length barrel, legally you can't go back to a shorter one. That will create an SBR, and I think by CA is an AW; not certain about that part since I never intended to do any of that.

The AOW designation gives your pistol more legal protection once approved by the ATF. Of course I haven't made it that far yet since I am waiting. But the Echelon chassis, as is in that link, as long as it does NOT have any forward grip of any type, put a brace on and you're good to go. From my understanding, IF you want to add a forward grip, then it must be approved as an AOW first.

I watched Reno May's video on this, plus guidance from @WojtekWeaponry to get to this understanding, which I'm fairly certain is correct.

As always, someone correct me if any of this is wrong.

 

[AR15barrels]

then why are people saying it's an illegal AW config? I don't get it

The AW laws are separate from AOW/SBR laws.
The AW laws primarily apply to semi-autos and you have to keep a semi-auto AOW legal under the AW laws.
The pump action AOW's do not trigger any AW laws and are exempt of the SBS law but semi-auto pistols converted into AOW's do fall under parts of the AW laws.
Making the semi-auto pistols have a fixed magazine gets them around the AW laws.

(a) Notwithstanding Section 30510, “assault weapon” also means any of the following:

(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:

(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.

(B) A thumbhole stock.

(C) A folding or telescoping stock.

(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.

(E) A flash suppressor.

(F) A forward pistol grip.

(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.

(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.

(4) A semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:

(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.

(B) A second handgrip.

(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer’s hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.

(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.

(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.

(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:

(A) A folding or telescoping stock.

(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.

(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that does not have a fixed magazine.

(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.

(9) A semiautomatic centerfire firearm that is not a rifle, pistol, or shotgun, that does not have a fixed magazine, but that has any one of the following:

(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.

(B) A thumbhole stock.

(C) A folding or telescoping stock.

(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.

(E) A flash suppressor.

(F) A forward pistol grip.

(G) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.

(H) A second handgrip.

(I) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer’s hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.

(J) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.

(10) A semiautomatic centerfire firearm that is not a rifle, pistol, or shotgun, that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.

(11) A semiautomatic centerfire firearm that is not a rifle, pistol, or shotgun, that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.

(b) For purposes of this section, “fixed magazine” means an ammunition feeding device contained in, or permanently attached to, a firearm in such a manner that the device cannot be removed without disassembly of the firearm action.

 

[Gawernator]

The AW laws are separate from AOW/SBR laws.
The AW laws primarily apply to semi-autos and you have to keep a semi-auto AOW legal under the AW laws.
The pump action AOW's do not trigger any AW laws and are exempt of the SBS law but semi-auto pistols converted into AOW's do fall under parts of the AW laws.
Making the semi-auto pistols have a fixed magazine gets them around the AW laws.

So then the flux raider P320 chassis would still be illegal no matter what? Since the magazine is detachable. They seem to claim it doesn't have a foregrip but idk if that argument works

 

[AR15barrels]

So then the flux raider P320 chassis would still be illegal no matter what? Since the magazine is detachable. They seem to claim it doesn't have a foregrip but idk if that argument works

Without fixing BOTH magazines, the flux raider would absolutely be a CA assault weapon.

 

[M_N04H]

So then the flux raider P320 chassis would still be illegal no matter what? Since the magazine is detachable. They seem to claim it doesn't have a foregrip but idk if that argument works

Yep, seems like I had that part wrong. Apologies.

So it seems like all I can theoretically get is what I have applied for right now. Well hell, this sucks ass.

 

[M_N04H]

Without fixing BOTH magazines, the flux raider would absolutely be a CA assault weapon.

Foregrip or not... what a shame. Thanks for that clarification.

 

[M_N04H]

Wait a minute, the Echelon/P320 is "pistol". So we are only looking at this...

A semiautomatic pistol that does not have a fixed magazine but has any one of the following:

(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer

(B) A second handgrip

(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning the bearer's hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel

(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.

Assault Weapons Laws (California and Federal Law)

California Law on Assault Weapons California law currently bans certain assault weapons by specific type, series, and model and also by the firearm’s general characteristics as set forth in the three categories below. (Pen. Code, § 30510.) California law also generally prohibits the sale of...

www.oag.ca.gov

So based on that, it looks like this is good to go (which is what I am trying to get):

Strike SMC Bravo Chassis for Springfield Echelon 4.5

www.strikeindustries.com

Just don't attach a forward/second hand grip.

 

[Least Deranged Nowi Fan]

Yeah it's that simple, a chassis system with no foregrip is gtg. You could just attach a huge flashlight like a TLR9 and use it as in impromptu grip, which would be legal because nobody could argue a TLR9 was ever meant to be a foregrip. The picatinny rail section that holds it would be simply a dust cover like any other glock or p320, and not a barrel shroud

 

[AR15barrels]

So based on that, it looks like this is good to go (which is what I am trying to get):

Strike SMC Bravo Chassis for Springfield Echelon 4.5

www.strikeindustries.com

Just don't attach a forward/second hand grip...

...or a brace/stock.
If you put something on the back that you can shoulder, you have yourself a federal SBR because of how it's being used.

 

[Least Deranged Nowi Fan]

pretty sure the ATF gave up on braces months ago https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/atf-launches-new-era-reform/repeal

 

[BCar777]

...or a brace/stock.
If you put something on the back that you can shoulder, you have yourself a federal SBR because of how it's being used.

Yeah the P320 Flux Raider has a sliding stock. Kinda off topic but would a disability exempt any of that? Isn’t that what a brace is technically for? Please excuse my ignorance. I ask because I used to be right handed, strong arm/shoulder until a bad accident atrophied and disabled my arm and shoulder and hand.

 

[Gawernator]

Without fixing BOTH magazines, the flux raider would absolutely be a CA assault weapon.

Come on Supreme Court already

 

[AR15barrels]

pretty sure the ATF gave up on braces months ago https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/atf-launches-new-era-reform/repeal

We don't know how CA weighs in on it though.
CA does have it's own SBR laws and they get to determine if a brace is a stock on their own regardless of what the feds say.

 

[cali_jazz]

I still don't get what a AOW is either, or why I want it

One thing to keep in mind (it was mentioned somewhat earlier in this thread) is the practical side of going the AOW route. Even with the tax now at $0, a Form 1 still means NFA registration, engraving the firearm with your maker information, and a permanently registered NFA firearm.

It also affects resale. Selling it isn't impossible, but your buyer has to go through the NFA transfer process, file the appropriate ATF paperwork, and wait for approval before taking possession. That alone shrinks the pool of potential buyers compared to an ordinary firearm.

None of this necessarily makes it a bad idea, but it's worth considering against the benefit of a vertical foregrip and some possible protection from CA AW laws.

 

[TheRatDragon]

One thing to keep in mind (it was mentioned somewhat earlier in this thread) is the practical side of going the AOW route. Even with the tax now at $0, a Form 1 still means NFA registration, engraving the firearm with your maker information, and a permanently registered NFA firearm.

It also affects resale. Selling it isn't impossible, but your buyer has to go through the NFA transfer process, file the appropriate ATF paperwork, and wait for approval before taking possession. That alone shrinks the pool of potential buyers compared to an ordinary firearm.

None of this necessarily makes it a bad idea, but it's worth considering against the benefit of a vertical foregrip and some possible protection from CA AW laws.

Yes, to piggyback off what @cali_jazz said, having an AOW will severely restrict any potential resale due to the fact that you'd need an FFL/SOT of which there are only a few willing to deal with the public in our state and also of course we still have to deal with the ATF not approving AOW stamps still. Though I do have a good feeling something may actually get done here or something gets loose at least, having an AOW in the state of California is a lesson in civics and laws itself. I would not recommend getting an AOW unless you're comfortable with keeping the firearm potentially for the rest of your life. For me, that's okay because the Serbu Super Shorty is SUPER rare and only 6k were ever made and they have a legendary reputation and this is most definitely heirloom material.

But yeah everything else Cali Jazz said is completely 100% on point. Consider all angles before going down this road. Also research lawyers just in case.

 

[TheRatDragon]

So how do we go about getting a legal AOW here? I can just buy itI highly recommend taking a look at my guide on how to get an AOW in California on the /r/CAGuns subreddit when the ATF finally starts approving applications again. Here is the link.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CAguns/comments/1iy91r9/how_to_get_an_aow_in_california

Just a note before you read this comment, I AM NOT A LAWYER AND THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE. Please do not take it as legal advice, this is merely just derived from my experience obtaining my AOW in addition to watching Reno May's videos on AOWs as well as reading the California Firearms Penal Code as well as reading forum and reddit threads such as the one we are talking in right now. Please keep this in mind. Thank you.

I can't stress it enough, that guide is for eForm 4s ONLY. It is NOT a definitive guide on eForm 1s. If you want to find out how to acquire an eForm 1 AOW in California, I highly recommend watching Reno May's video on how to get an AOW in California. Here is the link to that video.

Keep in mind that is for eForm 1s ONLY. These are your two routes to legal CA AOWs. If you want the truth, the easier route is doing an eForm 1. It's been debated but it's generally agreed that smoothbore AOWs like the Serbu Super Shorty are a grey area and while they are exempt from the SBS ban, dealers don't quite know how to DROS them except a few. There's no definitive law that paints them as handguns legally but AOWs ARE exempt from the unconventional handgun law in California in addition to the SBR/SBS exemptions so they're not quite handguns either. They are like their own little category except they aren't recognized as a category, just an exemption from restrictions that would otherwise make them illegal to possess here in the state. So that's why I said you have to be careful and research lawyers because I didn't do this without first consulting a lawyer. It's known this is a highly grey area that needs more explanation but hasn't really been explained in depth except for its penal code definition.