Ca 3 in 30 new rule, FFL03/COE Exemption

[jbl5150]

I think a number of the readers have their FFL03/COE. With the new 3 in 30 firearm purchase limit, there is language that exempts FFL03 holders from this limitation (same as when 1 in 30 was in effect).
As a suggestion, it would be helpful to have a list of stores that honor the exemption for either a new sale or PPT. I can start as I was just informed today that Poway range (PWG) does not honor that exemption. Thoughts and feedback appreciated.

 

[Specialist_muted]

This wasn’t needed a few years ago. Just CA making people jump through more hoops and pay a livescam.

People in free states don’t have to do this at all and can get stuff delivered without the scrutiny.

Absolutely agree. It's typical Sacramento BS. But until various legal challenges force this issue through the slow-rolling judicial system, this is the situation we will continue to find ourselves in.

 

[HouseWork]

Why don't you guys just call the DOJ and get an answer from them instead of playing the game of unsurity?

 

[BONECUTR]

Why don't you guys just call the DOJ and get an answer from them instead of playing the game of unsurity?

#1 CADOJ doesn't typically answer these questions for the general public. They normally just refer to the DOJ website.
#2 Dealers who they will talk too generally don't like talking to them. They feel the CADOJ is just looking for a reason to investigate them so they try to fly under the radar.

 

[Wolkenflieger]

Why don't you guys just call the DOJ and get an answer from them instead of playing the game of unsurity?

*uncertainty

 

[AsapWheels]

#1 CADOJ doesn't typically answer these questions for the general public. They normally just refer to the DOJ website.
#2 Dealers who they will talk too generally don't like talking to them. They feel the CADOJ is just looking for a reason to investigate them so they try to fly under the radar.

The second part isn’t true, I’ve called the DOJ multiple times and most of the time it is a “I’m not sure” and “let me escalate this to the manager team” that being said I’ve looked into it more and dealers can use that as an exemption. We have nothing to hide and trust me no firearm store is “flying under the radar” of the CA DOJ lol

I am the manager of the Elite Armory and we said we were not sure if we could or not so we were just erring on the side of caution, as my team and I did not know.

3rd being called “anti-gun” while working in the firearm industry and the store as a collective is kinda crazy to say because we just didn’t know. We strive to be a premier location in the Central Valley.

 

[BONECUTR]

The second part isn’t true, I’ve called the DOJ multiple times and most of the time it is a “I’m not sure” and “let me escalate this to the manager team” that being said I’ve looked into it more and dealers can use that as an exemption. We have nothing to hide and trust me no firearm store is “flying under the radar” of the CA DOJ lol

I am the manager of the Elite Armory and we said we were not sure if we could or not so we were just erring on the side of caution, as my team and I did not know.

I know a few dealers who call me for advice on issues and if I don't know Ill tell them to call the DOJ and I have heard on at least 5 occasions they don't want to call them as if they don't know the answer CADOJ will think they don't know what they are doing.

I call the DOJ a few times a month. Im well on their radar so couldn't care.

 

[AR15barrels]

OK but again, it serves no practical purpose by itself is my point. For someone not in the firearms industry, it doesn't do anything.

People who work in childcare or as teachers or in healthcare often are required to get COE/livescans as well.
It's basically being used as proof that you are not a criminal and as an active background check.
If you get arrested (not even convicted), they can pull your COE and then the entity requesting the notifications will be notified that your COE is no longer valid and you will likely be suspended or fired from a job that requires you to keep a clean record.

 

[9Cal_OC]

People who work in childcare or as teachers or in healthcare often are required to get COE's as well.
It's basically being used as proof that you are not a criminal and as an active background check.
If you get arrested (not even convicted), they can pull your COE and then the entity requesting the COE notifications will be notified that your COE is no longer valid and you will likely be suspended or fired from a job that requires you to carry a valid COE.

Doesn’t Livescam do the same thing?

Which is required for a COE. Seems like a COE is just another money grab/hoop to jump through.

 

[AR15barrels]

Doesn’t Livescam do the same thing?

Which is required for a COE. Seems like a COE is just another money grab/hoop to jump through.

Yes, and yes.

 

[Skilly]

People who work in childcare or as teachers or in healthcare often are required to get COE/livescans as well.
It's basically being used as proof that you are not a criminal and as an active background check.
If you get arrested (not even convicted), they can pull your COE and then the entity requesting the notifications will be notified that your COE is no longer valid and you will likely be suspended or fired from a job that requires you to keep a clean record.

Lots of comments talking about the FFL-03 and the COE and people complaining about how getting a COE didn't require your FFL-03 in hand previously etc.
My point is that the COE by itself is for people in an industry requiring it for employment and that background check. And, you if that is your requirement you can do that. Aside from that, by itself, It doesn't serve any other purpose on its own. And the FFL-03 is VERY limited in my mind to a value unless you are regularly searching for C&R in other states (in person) and wanting the ease of an OTC purchase you can bring home. For sure those people exist.

With the thread talking about the 3 in 30, my point is only both of them together overcome expensive ammo and the 3 in 30.

 

[2muchsoysauce4allthisrice]

yesterday, i had an ffl during a ppt, when i showed my credentials for the 3 in 30 exemption; told me is only valid for c&r. i told them no, they contacted their manager, and their manager also said it’s only for c&r. so, that counted towards my 1 in 30. i forgot that i had printed the exemption list from that find law.com with me; but i didn’t have the official doj bulletin printed out. maybe i should print that out and show them on pick up day for future purposes so other people don’t have to go through the same issue.

right before that ppt, i was at another ffl for a different ppt, that honored the exemption (upon showing proof of credentials) for a non-c&r; no hassle.

 

[Scubabugdiver]

I’ve stopped buying guns and ammo from Poway W&G. Ive had numerous encounters/ arguments with “management “ over the years when the written law was on my side. If you have any situation that can be considered remotely in a grey area, automatically assume that they will not cooperate. The last time I was told they just don’t want to deal with any thing outstanding or “difficult “ when they get audited, which is frequently from what I understand. They have what I call “Turners Syndrome ”. I just stick to using their range.

We should label FFL’s that are difficult and uncooperative as having “Turners Syndrome ”. Maybe I’ve started something….

 

[lilkidx]

yesterday, i had an ffl during a ppt, when i showed my credentials for the 3 in 30 exemption; told me is only valid for c&r. i told them no, they contacted their manager, and their manager also said it’s only for c&r. so, that counted towards my 1 in 30. i forgot that i had printed the exemption list from that find law.com with me; but i didn’t have the official doj bulletin printed out. maybe i should print that out and show them on pick up day for future purposes so other people don’t have to go through the same issue.

right before that ppt, i was at another ffl for a different ppt, that honored the exemption (upon showing proof of credentials) for a non-c&r; no hassle.

This happened to me, we had some back and forth, they checked their documents, I showed them my print outs, showed them the FAQ: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs#24
Their manager ended up calling the DOJ and now they're educated. I feel like dealers are just scared of misinterpreting the law which is fair. But glad they were willing to work towards that instead of flat out refusing or being stubborn about it.

 

[pancakes]

Pretty sure i drosd like 11-13 within the last 30days

 

[sportsballfan]

Pretty sure i drosd like 11-13 within the last 30days

I just did 4 in the last 30, and needed the FFL03/COE for the 4th one.

I thought it was done at the CA DOJ level, but the store called me back and told me to bring my docs in along with payment for another background check as the store/dealer verifies the docs and applies the exemption before they start the DROS.

It's worth the time and effort go obtain the FFL03/COE.

We're all here to learn. . I hope this helps others, too.

 

[Dooder]

You know back in the day I would understand dealers not understanding the Law.... But its spelled out in:

The penal code
To CADOJ dealer bullitins
View attachment 180738
and even a selectable option when they run the DROS
View attachment 180737
If a dealer claims they still don't know you should call them idiots and never shop there.

It depends on the city or county ordinance. For example there were no exemptions to the 1 in 30 and there is no exemptions to the 3 in 30 in Los Angeles CITY as it's a city ordinance. Just like how there's much that is federally legal but CA says no. Sometimes CA says yes just as they did with cannabis. Maybe Poway doesn't know what they're doing or maybe there's an underlying rule. Funny how a shop that operates on the safe side to prevent breaking rules are deemed idiots and subject to boycott but a shop that breaks rules and leads to trouble doesn't get criticized or boycotted.

 

[boostoss]

RifleGear honors this. They are the GOATS

 

[BONECUTR]

It depends on the city or county ordinance. For example there were no exemptions to the 1 in 30 and there is no exemptions to the 3 in 30 in Los Angeles CITY as it's a city ordinance. Just like how there's much that is federally legal but CA says no. Sometimes CA says yes just as they did with cannabis. Maybe Poway doesn't know what they're doing or maybe there's an underlying rule. Funny how a shop that operates on the safe side to prevent breaking rules are deemed idiots and subject to boycott but a shop that breaks rules and leads to trouble doesn't get criticized or boycotted.

To my knowledge the LA city rule is the only one like that in the state and the (2??) dealers that fall in that zone are fairly educated about it.

I got into it with Poway a long time ago when the refused to transfer a lower I shipped them because they said it needed a bullet button.... even though it was just a lower. They claimed that's what their DOJ auditor told them. When I asked them would it need a bullet button if it was build into a bolt action or a rimfire? They said no but yet still refused the transfer.

 

[Dooder]

To my knowledge the LA city rule is the only one like that in the state and the (2??) dealers that fall in that zone are fairly educated about it.

I got into it with Poway a long time ago when the refused to transfer a lower I shipped them because they said it needed a bullet button.... even though it was just a lower. They claimed that's what their DOJ auditor told them. When I asked them would it need a bullet button if it was build into a bolt action or a rimfire? They said no but yet still refused the transfer.

I hear you. The shops will do whatever it is they think is right. There's many shops here in SoCal that had to go to great lengths to correct actions they interpreted as correct. Just gotta go someplace else. But I totally agree with you a shop should at least follow the rules. Actually it's not even "at least" it's "all that's expected" haaha.

 

[BONECUTR]

I hear you. The shops will do whatever it is they think is right. There's many shops here in SoCal that had to go to great lengths to correct actions they interpreted as correct. Just gotta go someplace else. But I totally agree with you a shop should at least follow the rules. Actually it's not even "at least" it's "all that's expected" haaha.

Right, I ship guns all the time to shops that don't know the law and I know I'm never going to be able to convince them. But after I get my gun back Ill tell them hat idiots they are and will refuse to even ship guns to them again.

Sometimes its a whole company.... sometimes its just a specific location. Im not going to out them cause Im cool with the company but one location at one time was ran by retards. I shipped a gun and my customer when there 4 times and they kept telling him they didnt receive it. He had tracking showing it was signed for over a week before and they kept swearing they had never seen it. Finally I got someone with a brain on the phone who found it within minutes and called the customer. I refused to ship to that location for years.