Denied PPT

[M2A1.50]

Afternoon,

So I had done a PPT, this past week. I arrived with the necessary paperwork at my LGS then realized I when I got my Real driver's license they used my middle name, but on my CAC(military ID) it's not there because I didn't want to use it when I enlisted. I asked if I'd get denied for that I was told it shouldn't be, I asked if I was, could get my wife to dros it they said no. The seller was right there and said if you don't get approved then you(me) lose my dros and the money given to the seller and he keeps his gun. I did the ppt anyways knowing I should have no issue as I have purchased firearms before. I'm hoping the seller was joking because money is money, and I would hope he would give back my money if I got denied. Have anyone experienced anything like this and what would you have done?

 

[Hylander]

Did they put your middle name in the dros?
Did you put your middle name on the 4473?
If yes to both, there should be no issue.

 

[M2A1.50]

Yes I did, and they used my full name and my alias without my middle name

 

[Shredla]

a few months ago I was denied in person on the 10th day for what should have been my pickup date. For years the form of ID i used to receive firearms was my CCW, upon letting it go, I relied in my CA DL. My CA DL did NOT contain my middle name, my supporting paperwork did. Even tho the supporting paperwork had the same address as the CA DL, the simple fact that one document contained a middle name and the other did not, I was denied the background check and forced to apply for a REAL CA DL that does not have federal limits on it. This issue didnt even pop up until the person that was filling out the 4473 to release the firearm to me noticed the middle name issue. The person(s) whom initially did the 4473 10 days prior didnt notice the issue.
Big waste of time.

 

[Pewpewwagon]

How much money was this firearm? 20 dollars? Did you find this firearm on caguns? What is his user name?

 

[M2A1.50]

How much money was this firearm? 20 dollars? Did you find this firearm on caguns? What is his user name?

It was a couple hundred, he's on here. I'm not trying to stir the pot unless it comes to it. And it was on here where I found this firearm.

 

[Ron Swanson]

On the occasion this happens ( never had it happen to me or anyone I know) the seller may partial refund for his time, if any. That amount might depend on how far they had to go. Not sure if you can try to DROS again but again, and if you need them to come again, may want to be compensated for their time for that as well.

All of it sucks but sounds like this will end up being more money than you wanted it to be.

 

[Hylander]

If as a seller, my buyer gets denied, I would hold back some money for my inconvenience.
Like gas money and time.
But I would return most of it.
However, you did agree to the sellers terms in advance.

 

[Ron Swanson]

I'm not clear if my understanding here is correct, so someone tell me. The DROS is passing, but it sounds like the shop is denying based on a middle name being on one document and not on the other? Or please clarify.

 

[M2A1.50]

On the occasion this happens ( never had it happen to me or anyone I know) the seller may partial refund for his time, if any. That amount might depend on how far they had to go. Not sure if you can try to DROS again but again, and if you need them to come again, may want to be compensated for their time for that as well.

All of it sucks but sounds like this will end up being more money than you wanted it to be.

And I would be understanding for his time and compensate him for his time indeed but full price is insane.

 

[westsidearms]

Okay there really are at least two issues here.

1) the gun store should tell you ahead of time if they are going to accept your documents. I doubt you would get denied by the CA DOJ based on what your documents say because your documents do not get submitted to DROS. Only text the dealer enters. So whether your middle name is there or not really should not matter as long as your DOB and DL # do not come back to a prohibited person.

2) The seller can set whatever conditions on the sale they want. It is up to you to agree to them or not. I actually would not blame a seller for telling a buyer that any denied DROS would not incur a refund and the gun by law goes back to the seller. If I sell a gun to someone and they get denied, I might have already spent that money and I have zero desire to refund it. Make sure you can pass a background check otherwise the gun is returned to the seller and that is the law. I mean if you other sellers want to have a return fee, I respect that. I also respect someone who plays hardball. Make sure your affairs are in order.

a few months ago I was denied in person on the 10th day for what should have been my pickup date. For years the form of ID i used to receive firearms was my CCW, upon letting it go, I relied in my CA DL. My CA DL did NOT contain my middle name, my supporting paperwork did. Even tho the supporting paperwork had the same address as the CA DL, the simple fact that one document contained a middle name and the other did not, I was denied the background check and forced to apply for a REAL CA DL that does not have federal limits on it. This issue didnt even pop up until the person that was filling out the 4473 to release the firearm to me noticed the middle name issue. The person(s) whom initially did the 4473 10 days prior didnt notice the issue.
Big waste of time.

This sounds like your gun store screwed you. I hope you received a 100% refund for them being stupid. They could have just as easily accepted everything and buried it in their paperwork and if the CA DOJ does not audit them in 3 years, they shred everything and no one cares. This is a lesson to find a good gun dealer that works for you, not the state. And if they are going to screw up, the eat the cost on everything and re-DROS or 100% refund.

 

[M2A1.50]

I'm not clear if my understanding here is correct, so someone tell me. The DROS is passing, but it sounds like the shop is denying based on a middle name being on one document and not on the other? Or please clarify.

They took the paperwork and tripled checked I believe, I know at least 2 set of eyes were on it. I was just asking a simple question probably should've written a little bit differently.

 

[M2A1.50]

Okay there really are at least two issues here.

1) the gun store should tell you ahead of time if they are going to accept your documents. I doubt you would get denied by the CA DOJ based on what your documents say because your documents do not get submitted to DROS. Only text the dealer enters. So whether your middle name is there or not really should not matter as long as your DOB and DL # do not come back to a prohibited person.

2) The seller can set whatever conditions on the sale they want. It is up to you to agree to them or not. I actually would not blame a seller for telling a buyer that any denied DROS would not incur a refund and the gun by law goes back to the seller. If I sell a gun to someone and they get denied, I might have already spent that money and I have zero desire to refund it. Make sure you can pass a background check otherwise the gun is returned to the seller and that is the law. I mean if you other sellers want to have a return fee, I respect that. I also respect someone who plays hardball. Make sure your affairs are in order.


This sounds like your gun store screwed you. I hope you received a 100% refund for them being stupid. They could have just as easily accepted everything and buried it in their paperwork and if the CA DOJ does not audit them in 3 years, they shred everything and no one cares. This is a lesson to find a good gun dealer that works for you, not the state. And if they are going to screw up, the eat the cost on everything and re-DROS or 100% refund.

I agree, I just wanted to know if anyone else had experience with this kind of issue with a middle name that is all. Refunds or not, this is the first issue ever that concerned me.

 

[Dvrjon]

Afternoon,

So I had done a PPT, this past week. I arrived with the necessary paperwork at my LGS then realized I when I got my Real driver's license they used my middle name, but on my CAC(military ID) it's not there because I didn't want to use it when I enlisted. I asked if I'd get denied for that I was told it shouldn't be, I asked if I was, could get my wife to dros it they said no. The seller was right there and said if you don't get approved then you(me) lose my dros and the money given to the seller and he keeps his gun. I did the ppt anyways knowing I should have no issue as I have purchased firearms before. I'm hoping the seller was joking because money is money, and I would hope he would give back my money if I got denied. Have anyone experienced anything like this and what would you have done?

The title of your thread is "Denied PPT". But, you haven't AS OF NOW been denied, correct?

You used your RealID for identification, and something else for additional residence proof, yes? (Presuming it was a handgun). Where did the CAC come into this? The only thing that is good for is to waive the firearm demonstration and the FSC requirement. But that's administrative at the store and doesn't subject the document to OAG review.

If you have firearms purchases on record through DROS and in AFS, and if you used your RealID, and if you read through the Form 4474 to ensure everything was correct, your documentation won't stop the sale.

And yeah, the seller can keep the cash and the gun if the sale fails. So, pick your seller well and negotiate contingencies before you hit the store.

 

[westsidearms]

The title of your thread is "Denied PPT". But, you haven't been denied, correct?
You used your RealID for identification, and something else for additional residence proof, yes? (Presuming it was a handgun). Where did the CAC come into this? If you have firearms purchases on record through DROS and in AFS, and if you used your RealID, and if you read through the Form 4474 to ensure everything was correct, your documentation won't stop the sale.

And yeah, the seller can keep the cash and the gun if the sale fails. So, pick your seller well and negotiate contingencies before you hit the store.

If I had to guess, CAC was to be FSC exempt.

 

[Dvrjon]

If I had to guess, CAC was to be FSC exempt.

While you typed, I added the FSC and the safe handling waivers.

 

[Dvrjon]

a few months ago I was denied in person on the 10th day for what should have been my pickup date. For years the form of ID i used to receive firearms was my CCW, upon letting it go, I relied in my CA DL. My CA DL did NOT contain my middle name, my supporting paperwork did. Even tho the supporting paperwork had the same address as the CA DL, the simple fact that one document contained a middle name and the other did not, I was denied the background check and forced to apply for a REAL CA DL that does not have federal limits on it. This issue didnt even pop up until the person that was filling out the 4473 to release the firearm to me noticed the middle name issue. The person(s) whom initially did the 4473 10 days prior didnt notice the issue.

Big waste of time.

So, DOJ cleared the sale for pick up and approved the release, but your FFL stopped the release because they had a problem with the paperwork DOJ had approved?

Do you have a passport or Birth Certificate?
CA 11 CCR 4045.1:

(“(b) For all eligibility checks, if the applicant presents a federal non-compliant California driver license or identification card with the notation "FEDERAL LIMITS APPLY" on the front, the applicant shall also submit proof of lawful presence in the United States, as specified in subdivisions (d) through (g), in the form of one of the following documents:
(1) Valid, unexpired U.S. passport or passport card.
(2) Certified copy of U.S. birth certificate (issued by a city, county, or state vital statistics office). "Abbreviated" or "Abstract" certificates are NOT accepted.”)

 

[M2A1.50]

The title of your thread is "Denied PPT". But, you haven't AS OF NOW been denied, correct?

You used your RealID for identification, and something else for additional residence proof, yes? (Presuming it was a handgun). Where did the CAC come into this? The only thing that is good for is to waive the firearm demonstration and the FSC requirement. But that's administrative at the store and doesn't subject the document to OAG review.

If you have firearms purchases on record through DROS and in AFS, and if you used your RealID, and if you read through the Form 4474 to ensure everything was correct, your documentation won't stop the sale.

And yeah, the seller can keep the cash and the gun if the sale fails. So, pick your seller well and negotiate contingencies before you hit the store.

Everything was correct on paperwork and I did use my REALiD. I'm probably just paranoid.

 

[M2A1.50]

So, DOJ cleared the sale for pick up and approved the release, but your FFL stopped the release because they had a problem with the paperwork DOJ had approved?

Do you have a passport or Birth Certificate?
CA 11 CCR 4045.1:

I should've written a better title. I have not been denied, I'm clumsy with writing. I just wanted to know if I would denied of my PPT because of a missing middle name. I've had previous purchases using my full name minus my middle name on all my firearms.

 

[Hylander]

What is your pick up date?
What shop did you dros at?