Answered Off topic?

[doser]

OT was hilarious. Some of the best characters and the best threads appeared there. I never take it too seriously. I would definitely bring it back. Also bring back MILF Monday and I will moderate that!!!

I think we'll pass on that. Welcome! Just a reminder this isn't CGN

 

[Radman64]

I think we'll pass on that. Welcome! Just a reminder this isn't CGN

This OT thing just sounds like a bomb ready to go off imo. there is no question how to do something that one cant find on YouTube for one.
Secondly if one wants to rant on some crazy topic with like minds I'm sure there is a reddit thread for that also.

 

[NapalmCheese]

Off Topic was a cesspool of hate and bigotry, dominated by frequent posting hateful bigots, and moderated by moderators sympathetic to hateful bigots to create an echo chamber to amplify hate and bigotry. Cal Guns would have been better without it, and CAguns IS better without it. Despite breaking news (most breaking news threads quickly being dominated by said hateful bigots anyway), the juice isn't worth the squeeze on that one. ARFcom is only a few clicks away; let the OT lovers post their OT content there.

 

[Radman64]

When someone is posting they miss MILF Monday pretty much says it all.

 

[ZeroFoxGiven]

Off Topic was a cesspool of hate and bigotry, dominated by frequent posting hateful bigots, and moderated by moderators sympathetic to hateful bigots to create an echo chamber to amplify hate and bigotry. Cal Guns would have been better without it, and CAguns IS better without it. Despite breaking news (most breaking news threads quickly being dominated by said hateful bigots anyway), the juice isn't worth the squeeze on that one. ARFcom is only a few clicks away; let the OT lovers post their OT content there.

If OT comes here, and starts looking like Calguns then I'm probably gonna bounce. I DO NOT, as a legal gun carrier want any association with that garbage. God forbid I ever had to defend myself in court, the last thing I want to hear about is my association with a gun website that pushes at best "Questionable" points of view; wether I post in that sub forum or not.

You want to hoot and howler like a jackass, there a literally 100's, nay 1000's of sites for you to do that on. Aren't our 2nd Amendment Rights under attack already, why give gun grabbers free ammo against us.

To those who say that OT wasn't Racist, etc, your white washing a lot of the arguments over the years. I agree there were some truly funny threads, but 1 funny per 10 hate fueled rants is not worth it.

 

[tedster]

I just happen to be able to login at CGN. Took a quick look into the socalled OT sub.
It's awful what is being posted over there. It's their OT, but the same characters also have access to every other part of CGN.
I'm a 'Nay' when it comes to OT sub forums harboring crowds like these.

 

[tedster]

I also found it noteworthy in the OT over there, none of those hard-hitting wise crackers shows a contributor badge below their avatar.
What does that tell you. I did make a contribution in 2024, because I wanted the site to run ok again. Small price for a big cause.
Membership is a delicate thing. I don't mind a tough hand to keep a clean site.

 

[ikeo1]

I just happen to be able to login at CGN. Took a quick look into the socalled OT sub.
It's awful what is being posted over there. It's their OT, but the same characters also have access to every other part of CGN.
I'm a 'Nay' when it comes to OT sub forums harboring crowds like these.

Yeah, I agree. It's ok. I'm glad they are not here with that type of attitude. It's not helpful for growth and very detrimental to it. It makes me more clear that if people come here with that type of attitude, it will not be tolerated here.

I've had around 60 posts in OT and after seeing the personalities there. It's obvious why CGN has gone the direction it has and not grown and imploded. You have non-contributors attacking people for anything they disagree with politically who don't shoot firearms. They're on a 2A site that tolerates them and managed to take over the culture of Calguns. It seems like their strategy is to drive people out who actually want to discuss ideas.

To be clear, I'm not against political discussion. I enjoy a good challenge and enjoy reading good discourse. The Biden Pardon turned out better than I hoped. To me the goal shouldn't be about winning, its more about listening to people you can respect and learn from. People that challenge your own ideas that can make you a better thinker. People that will acknowledge your points instead of ignore them and address them are super valuable IMO.

 

[tedster]

Actually, I’m just looking around at CGN to see what’s really going on.
I had a S&W revolver in the handgun marketplace that is SPF now.
How that happened I’m done over there.

 

[ikeo1]

...

I used to check there every so often to see the activity but now I think they've won. I don't see a reason for me to visit the site any longer. I used to keep tabs on a number of metrics. They still have some good movement in the marketplace but its nothing really new. Mostly bumps and with buyers moving over here, it's time to close that chapter.

 

[tedster]

Lol, you caught my post. It’s not quite as dramatic as I thought. But, it is very thin over there. Keep building this place. Form & Function is everything. The rest can be developed.

 

[The Gleam]

The Off-Topic section of Calguns was like the spare folding table you brought out of the closet at Thanksgiving, in order to have a place to seat the kids, in the other room, away from the adults, so the adults could have meaningful productive conversations on adult topics. ( Like guns and the 2nd Amendment. )

In that regard, it was a benefit; it kept the children out of the gun forums.

Unfortunately for Calguns, 'Off Topic' then became the primary forum driver that got the most traffic, and like a drug, drew members away from the primary focus of 2nd Amendment activism and guns in general. It became a general fodder social-media club that lost its way.

There were guys that exclusively posted in Off-Topic, others at 98% or more if they mentioned guns at all, who I doubt were even gun owners in the first place.

---

 

[tedster]

The Off-Topic section of Calguns was like the spare folding table you brought out of the closet at Thanksgiving, in order to have a place to seat the kids, in the other room, away from the adults, so the adults could have meaningful productive conversations on adult topics. ( Like guns and the 2nd Amendment. )

In that regard, it was a benefit; it kept the children out of the gun forums.

Unfortunately for Calguns, 'Off Topic' then became the primary forum driver that got the most traffic, and like a drug, drew members away from the primary focus of 2nd Amendment activism and guns in general. It became a general fodder social-media club that lost its way.

There were guys that exclusively posted in Off-Topic, others at 98% or more if they mentioned guns at all, who I doubt were even gun owners in the first place.

---

This kind of observation is very common, also in social media websites of other genres.
Websites with selective off topic sub forums can have dramatically more traffic in those off topic sections compared to those related to the Website's original purpose. It all depends how the webmaster runs the site.

Below an example. It's a German website for Bass Players.
The primary Instrument specific segment has 11 sub forums
The off topic segment has 12 ( it even has an off- 'off topic' sub forum).
On the right are columns for topic and posts.
I added up the 3 digit post counts only.
Main forum segment: 433k posts
Off topic segment: 1,080 million posts

The layout of this website is obviously designed like this and is mostly un-moderated.



This website has a sister Website for musicians in general, which is heavily moderated.
Just take a look at the layout and note the tiny 'off topic' segment at the bottom of the forum list.

https://www.musiker-board.de/forum/

Btw., the Bass Player website bassic.de also has a politics & religion sub forum which is hidden, even if you are registered. It will pop up once you have 200 post count and you are NOT on the ban list. The Musiker-Board website used to have a much larger off topic segment also with politics & religion.
They removed it from the site as a condition to get large online retailers to sponsor the site and advertise on it.

 

[Ryan Gosling]

This kind of observation is very common, also in social media websites of other genres.
Websites with selective off topic sub forums can have dramatically more traffic in those off topic sections compared to those related to the Website's original purpose. It all depends how the webmaster runs the site.

Below an example. It's a German website for Bass Players.
The primary Instrument specific segment has 11 sub forums
The off topic segment has 12 ( it even has an off- 'off topic' sub forum).
On the right are columns for topic and posts.
I added up the 3 digit post counts only.
Main forum segment: 433k posts
Off topic segment: 1,080 million posts

The layout of this website is obviously designed like this and is mostly un-moderated.

View attachment 21384View attachment 21383

This website has a sister Website for musicians in general, which is heavily moderated.
Just take a look at the layout and note the tiny 'off topic' segment at the bottom of the forum list.

https://www.musiker-board.de/forum/

Btw., the Bass Player website bassic.de also has a politics & religion sub forum which is hidden, even if you are registered. It will pop up once you have 200 post count and you are NOT on the ban list. The Musiker-Board website used to have a much larger off topic segment also with politics & religion.
They removed it from the site as a condition to get large online retailers to sponsor the site and advertise on it.

All i gathered was we should have a bass player subforum

 

[tedster]

Yeah, you bet !

The formula is very simple:
Website, no OT esp. politics/religion + moderators will assure a smoother, rather conflict free environment.
Website with OT = guaranteed tumultuous if un-moderated, moderating requires a significant amount of resources.

I used the examples to backup what I am stating. I know, it's a lot and can be confusing.
Those who do the dirt throwing in un-moderated OT sub-forums will call this site here a restriction of their 1A rights and the admin/webmaster a dictator.

 

[governmentsucks1776]

Just look at the views... that speaks for itself. Way way more than everything else. If you want this place to grow allow OT

 

[ikeo1]

Just look at the views... that speaks for itself. Way way more than everything else. If you want this place to grow allow OT

I think you said you were young, if so, the main thing in my experience is when you're building a site/company. What is your brand identity going to be? In this case, it's a conscious choice to keep things smaller while we build our core users. This site is young and growing so the influence we want as of now is one that will help define the sites' personality.

This niche isn't so much about number of users, we're a specialized site. We don't have a lot of moderators but will have some soon. I'm working on the backend for this over the holidays. We'll get more users but OT wasn't my plan on how to do it.

We will be sponsoring USPSA shooters and maybe other top California shooters in the future. I didn't get to sponsor matches this year, but we will in 2025. I used my funds and supporter funds to offer additional listings, expand the site, and add new features. Next year we can start to expand.

 

[NorCalBusa]

Hope we can get some CRPA and FPC representation on board. They are fighting the fight and the site could help them get more financial support. More importantly, it could be a great spot for when they want to get the word out quickly and wide, do interviews, post issues and thinking. Be a nice 2A anchor for sure.

 

[The Gleam]

I think you said you were young, if so, the main thing in my experience is when you're building a site/company. What is your brand identity going to be? In this case, it's a conscious choice to keep things smaller while we build our core users. This site is young and growing so the influence we want as of now is one that will help define the sites' personality.

This niche isn't so much about number of users, we're a specialized site. We don't have a lot of moderators but will have some soon. I'm working on the backend for this over the holidays. We'll get more users but OT wasn't my plan on how to do it.

It is important to express to those that may not remember, or simply were not around for it at the time, but Calguns did NOT have an Off-Topic forum for the first few years it got started. (Nor did it have iTrader for that matter.)

The 'Off Topic' forum did not come around until later, after the site was well-established, and according to Kes himself, Off Topic was created because he and the mods were too busy and distracted with the task of chasing too many charlatans and useless twats out of the gun-related/2nd Amendment related forums, when they directed threads to stray off-topic or were essentially off-topic posts to start. The idea was much of what I was saying above; create a place where the groundlings can throw peanuts at each other, and not interrupt the show.

Then some several years later, when the Off Topic forum became an 'attractive nuisance' - it was made invisible to passing pedestrians unless they were members and logged in, as to not draw the wrong kind of interference, like flies to crap.

Because that's what it is.

---

 

[NapalmCheese]

I found that with OT, the same personalities and animosities continued to percolate into the rest of the forum. While Kes (or someone) would move threads or outright delete them as necessary, plenty of them were passed over and the moderation that DID happen seemed very, let's say, subjective (someone popping into a thread to say "cool it" vs just deleting it because they personally didn't like it).

I stopped reading OT years ago, but I continued to see the same hateful and bigoted ideas filter out into other areas of the forum as a wink and a nod.